Engine removal

[Daar]

New to forum. Can you pull the engine out separating at the bell housing and trany? 63 coupe 4 speed. David

[bbodie52]

Welcome, David, to the Corvair Forum!

The first time I removed a Corvair engine, I thought I could do it by pulling the engine alone, while leaving the transaxle in the car. While I was successful, success only came because the transmission was a Powerglide automatic. The torque converter allowed me to detach the connection from the engine crankshaft (flex plate) so that the torque converter remained on the differential. I managed to juggle the engine bell housing around the torque converter enough to lower the engine alone balanced on a hydraulic floor jack, and I did it without dropping the engine! However, I discovered that it would have been easier and safer to lower the entire engine and transaxle as a unit, and then separate them while stabilized on some 2x4 wood supports that supported the engine close to the floor.

In any case, it would not be possible to separate a manual transmission transaxle from the engine while leaving the transaxle mounted in the car. The way the input shaft connects to the clutch assembly just would not allow the engine to be removed within the car. Powerglide or manual transaxle — it is just safer and easier to lower the complete engine and transaxle (powertrain) from the car as a unit, as described in the attached shop manual and the attached Chevrolet publication: Corvair and Corvair 95 Power Train Removal & Installation.



I was 16 and working alone when I removed my first Corvair powertrain. I was nervously sweating like a pig in fear of dropping that heavy powertrain, but I managed to remove and lower it successfully! However, I would suggest having a few mechanically inclined/experienced friends on-hand to assist you with a safe removal. If there is a CORSA (Corvair Society of America) club chapter in your area, joining the club and asking for experienced advice, and perhaps recruiting some experienced helpers may be a good idea. The link below will provide you with some useful websites, shop manuals, parts suppliers, etc. There is also a listing of CORSA club chapters around the country. There might be an active club in your area.

Common and Useful Corvair Websites

Corvair Forum viewtopic.php?f=225&t=6007

The first time I ever separated a manual transaxle from a Corvair engine, well, I didn't exactly approach it correctly. I had the engine resting upon some stacks of two by fours. I removed the starter, and I unbolted the transaxle from the engine. Being young (17), overconfident, and healthy I decided that I could simply lift the heavy transaxle away from the engine and set it on the garage floor!

If you can picture this...

I straddled the transaxle and bent over and cupped my hands under it — cradling all of its weight in my hands as I was completely bent over and expecting to walk away with this heavy transaxle between my legs! That was when I discovered the issue with the long input shaft that inevitably remains embedded in the clutch disc. I was confronted with this very awkward moment (working alone, of course) when I had to try to figure out how to keep the alignment between the face of the differential and the clutch housing while balancing all of that weight in my hands, between my legs. I managed to take a whole series of very small backward steps while desperately trying to maintain the necessary alignment so that I would not damage the input shaft. That input shaft seemed soooooo long! But the small splined end finally came out of the differential and I was able to set the transaxle on the floor. I think I simply went into the house after that to lay down for awhile.

[66vairguy]

New to forum. Can you pull the engine out separating at the bell housing and trany? 63 coupe 4 speed. David

Some who are experienced do it. Without experience and a proper lift mechanism it is NOT advised.

I've found damaged parts that were caused by trying to get the engine out separate from the transaxle.

It's tempting to do, but it's one of those deals where taking out the entire drivetrain isn't much more effort and less subject to damaging things.

[erco]

Having just assembled mine out of the car, I can assure you that it's much easier to remove the whole power train.

Dollars to donuts you will mangle the differential oil seal as you R&R under the car, especially as a first timer. Then you'll leak oil on the clutch and have to do it all again.

Besides, having the diff & tranny out is the perfect time to drain & refill with fresh hypoid lube.
viewtopic.php?p=127895#p127895

Order your seal, gasket and lube now.

[Daar]

Thanks for all the feedback. Next question. Just bought this 63 - was a Spyder with turbo but the turbo got sold. Brief history sitting for 36 years. Engine was rebuilt by high school shop class. Been sitting on engine stand inside dry area. I have had the car for 6 days and I just got the engine to rotate this morning. Ya! Lots of penetrating oil and wd40 down the plug holes. I only turned it a few inches. My question how to lubricate things. Or should I take it apart and relube everything and put back together? David

[erco]

Or should I take it apart and relube everything and put back together? David

Absolutely, who knows what the students may have done in there. Enjoy the teardown!

[66vairguy]

The universal problem with a "rebuilt" engine is what was done. The engine may be fine. At a minimum you should change the oil and filter. Pull the distributor and use a drill and dummy shaft to prime the engine (and check oil pressure) while manually rotating it (yes two folks needed). I'd also pull the valve covers and liberally oil the valve train. If you have a bore scope you can check the cylinder lining for rust. Then you might take a chance on starting it.

HOWEVER -- if it were me I'd pull the top cover and check the cam and crank for rust. I'd pull the heads and check the cylinders for corrosion.

There are some good Corvair engine rebuilders out there, but I've bought several "rebuilt by unknown person" Corvair engines that when dismantled were a mess. I never pay much for them or I walk away. I've ended up with some good parts doing this that were worth the cost of buying the engine.

Just me ----

[erco]

If you have a bore scope you can check the cylinder lining for rust.

My 140 sat dormant in my garage for 20 years without any preventative storage actions. Despite the plethora of "will it run" videos on Youtube, I didn't want to even try starting it. I cringed at the thought of piston rings scraping over rusty cylinders, so I avoided turning the crank at all during teardown. Could not believe how easily the crank accidentally turned when I loosened the HD bolt. Then I pulled the heads and the cylinder walls were PERFECT. Zero rust. Crosshatch was still good. I was amazed. No ridge either. Carbon buildup only. That said, the motor needed new seals throughout and I went though and checked all the bearings & cam lobes.

IMO any motor that's new to you should be gone through. Corvairs are still weird by modern standards, and students may have taken shortcuts, stripped bolts or studs, etc. Look at an assembled motor as a complete pile of parts that needs TLC. In his book HTKYCA, author Finch dedicates a chapter to buying a brand new engine and tearing it down to rebuild for racing. He found plenty of room for improvement even when everything was new!

[erco]

More potential damage from removing the engine only: the delicate diff snout can crack under side load.

viewtopic.php?t=18148

[bbodie52]

Part number C7463: THROW OUT BEARING SHAFT FOR 2 SEALS NEEDS(2)SEALS-60-63=C494,64-69=C495 & 1 C1179

Weight: 1 lbs 4 oz
Catalog Page(s): 124(14)
Price: $ 59.60

Throw Out Bearing Shaft – Differential Must Be Disassembled. This is the part that the throw out bearing slides on. They are often cracked on the bottom which will allow them to leak gear oil onto the clutch. Many people are just replacing the stock cast ones with our super strong machined shafts to be safe. We offer the "bullet proof", top quality OTTO Parts shaft which also accepts 2 seals for double sealing protection. You can either install 1 seal which will be positioned in a slightly new position on the input shaft, or install 2 seals and the stock retaining ring. No modifications are necessary. Fits all 1960-69 standards. YOU MUST DISASSEMBLE THE DIFFERENTIAL. CL ARK'S are made to exacting tolerances and plated. DO NOT accept inferior throw out bearing shafts. There are several critical dimensions. If you are ordering a Gasket Set also remember to order (1) extra seal (#15). THROW OUT SHAFT for 2 SEALS

The replacement part is not that expensive, BUT YOU MUST COMPLETELY DISASSEMBLE THE DIFFERENTIAL TO REMOVE THE BROKEN PART!!! Taking the differential apart is bad enough, but the correct assembly requires a ton of trial and error alignment to adjust the gears to properly engage and mesh together. Watching the process performed really appears to be something of "black magic" requiring an infinite amount of patience and skill. Having to go through something like that because proper care was not taken when routinely separating the engine from the transaxle is a real pain that you don't want to have to go through!!!

[Dennis66]

"Not for the faint of heart". I managed to crush the input shaft seal on my '65 convertible. Got the clutch disc oil soaked. Learned ot be very careful after that. Late models definitely easier to remove just the engine, early models less room to work with. Regardless of transaxle left in car or removed with engine, make and use 2-3 3/8-16 guide pins to keep engine or transaxle load from pushing on input shaft. Have at minimum a rectangular plate secured to floor jack or use a suitable transmission jack (if removing only engine). For whole drivetrain, use a suitable cradle. Dennis

[terribleted]

You need to disconnect almost everything you would need to disconnect to remove the engine only as you would need disconnect to remove the entire powertrain. On an early model (pre 65), everything needed to remove the powertrain will be removed except the 2 nuts at the forward transmission mounts which will need to be loosened but not removed, so why not just remove those 2 nuts and lower the entire powertrain to the ground and out from under the car. powertrain out makes mating and unmating of components a bunch easier and access to everything is easy.

[erco]

Yes, the whole power pack is held in by just 4 nuts! Removing as a unit also makes it a cinch to replace your diff oil.

[Dennis66]

Not to start an argument, but its 3 nuts on an early model. You still have to deal with the clutch cross shaft, shift linkage, axles/ wheel removal, throttle linkage at bell crank. While I would encourage a first timer to get help, preferably from a "Corvair person", someone who knows what they are doing can remove just the engine from an early model without hurting anything. When I bought my '62 Monza coupe in high school, it needed a clutch. I dropped the engine, replaced the clutch, and drove it most of my senior year without problems. Dennis

[terribleted]

Not to start an argument, but its 3 nuts on an early model. You still have to deal with the clutch cross shaft, shift linkage, axles/ wheel removal, throttle linkage at bell crank. While I would encourage a first timer to get help, preferably from a "Corvair person", someone who knows what they are doing can remove just the engine from an early model without hurting anything. When I bought my '62 Monza coupe in high school, it needed a clutch. I dropped the engine, replaced the clutch, and drove it most of my senior year without problems. Dennis

I was assuming that if you removed the engine that the rear mounting nut would be removed. The 2 at the front need to be loosened in order to not stress the trans mounts from lowering the rear of the powertrain this far to remove the engine. Everything, linkages wiring, engine body seals etc. must be removed or disconnected in order to lower the rear this far leaving only the 2 (loosened) nuts at the front holding the powertrain in place. Given this why not just remove the whole powertrain was what I was saying.

[erco]

Related, I just found that my 65-style rear mount is pooched. $140 for a new 66-69 style one, Jeez. This is not a cheap car to work on anymore.