'62 Monza convertible "Ralphie"

[Dennis66]

So after a couple of weeks off (anniversary vacation), I got back to the Corvair project. I did some straightening out of engine sheet metal and a trial fit on the engine to measure for making new perimeter seals. Of note, the staples had already been removed from the sheet metal. I measured the width of the mounted side pieces (29-3/4''), and then measured the width of the engine compartment to where the seals attach (33''). Now I know how wide to make the seal strips. I believe my local Goodyear supply has the appropriate material to make the seals.
I had previously pressure washed the engine compartment, and removed most of the wiring and accessories, then came bad weather and vacation plans. This weekend, and then tonight I removed the hood, hinges, and support strut. Then I broke out my little sand blaster and began to hit the several bad spots that needed cleaning. I also went all around the hood opening getting under the lip of the opening. Went through a good gallon sized container of sand. Cleaned it all off, did a wipe down with lacquer thinner and hit the bare spots with gray primer. After that there were 10 holes in the rear where stuff had been added with sheet metal screws. No idea what the one was, but the other was for the electronic ignition module and the it used to have one of those spring loaded belt tensioners that was anchored behind the license plate. All looked butchered. I welded up all the (10) holes and will grind down the boogers before painting.

Left side - battery box

Right side - spare compartment

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[Project65]

Looking great Dennis! Can’t wait to see how it looks after it’s painted. I’m curious what your little sand blaster looks like. It appears to be a nice handy tool.

[Dennis66]

It's just the little Harbor Freight cheapie hand held. Had it for a bunch of years and for the price, can't complain at all. I've used it on a number of projects. For this one, I just used regular fine sand - swept up from the curb in front of my house and sifted. In the past I've used beach sand, and white play sand.

[Project65]

Nice! By the way, I like the fabricating the oil cooler cover. Way to improvise!

[Dennis66]

Another "baby step". Frustrating weekend. 4 days, but people pulling me in all different directions for most of it. Finally got a little "Corvair time" this afternoon. I had taken some of the tins to work and gave them a quick bath with the parts washer. Took a little of it and blasted remaining rust and paint off it this afternoon. Gave it a shot of primer, then black paint. Also counted and determined that I will need to make 33 staples for the perimeter seals for the tins. That's the sides and the front. I'm not sure what goes across the back, and I might even be missing that piece. Dennis
P.S. the other pieces are the end caps for the 12 plate cooler. The H.F. spot blaster works pretty good. I probably went through 5 reservoirs of sand, but the reservoir is small and the sand is free.

before cleaning

after cleaning

[Project65]

Nice work…even one piece at a time. I love the little blaster gun.

[66vairguy]

When it comes to rusty metal you can't beat sand blasting for removing ALL the rust oxide. I had a small sand blaster, but as Dennis66 knows it takes a while.

I finally found a place that uses fine sand (and they reduce the air pressure for sheet metal body panels). Their prices make it well worth it to have them do my stuff. Much faster than I could do parts. They haven't warped a panel yet and everything is bare metal clean!!

[Dennis66]

Finally got back to it. Weather still too unpredictable for painting engine compartment, so I got back to the engine. Guess it was about 3 weeks ago I cut the valve seats and lapped the valves. today was "moment of truth as I pressure checked them. Found 2 intakes and one exhaust that produced bubbles. Gave the one intake a light tap with the handle of my 3/8 ratchet and it stopped bubbling. Pulled the keepers and springs off the other two and found a tiny spec of debris on the seat of the intake. Not wanting to mess with putting the spring back on, I tried pressure checking with just thumb pressure on the valve face. NO BUBBLES. Two down. Popped the exhaust out and wiped valve and seat down and tried the thumb check. Again, no bubbles. Put everything back together and put the heads on for real this time.
Clarks instructions said to coat the head gaskets with never seize. I've never done this before, but I figured if Clark's said to, there must be a reason. Coated and installed. I decided to make sure it was on #1 TDC firing so I looked down inside and rotated the crank to zero. Both cam lobes were pointing to about 7 and 11, so this would put the lifters on the base circle of the cam #1 firing. Put all the lifters back in after giving an extra dab of assembly grease on the face of each lifter. Good to start getting all these carefully indeed parts back where they belong. I painted all the push rod tubes, installed the outer O-rings, put them through the holes in the heads, installed the inner O-rings, lubed everything and knocked them home with a 5/8 deep socket. Lubed the stud O-rings, placed them in the recesses in the heads, lubed the bottoms of the rocker stud bolts and put them in with the guides ("U''s facing out). Didn't torque anything yet, waiting for a fresh start to make sure I do everything right. Did clean all the 16 top cover bolts and install the top cover and breather. Good progress. Maybe pictures tomorrow. Dennis

[66vairguy]

Glad it is coming along nicely.

I've never read about putting never-seize on head gaskets. Are you using the crushable steel head gaskets or the thicker copper gaskets?

You didn't mention the valve guide clearance, I assume it was good enough. One theory about valve seat failure is that worn guides cause the valves to hit the seat unevenly causing the seat to loosen in the head. Interesting theory, not sure how valid it is.

I'd suggest "degreeing" the cam. One tooth is about 7 degrees off and is hard to "eyeball". Of course with stacked tolerances you won't get perfect numbers, but if everything is off about 7 degrees in the same direction, than you know you are off a tooth. With a new cam, cam gear, AND crank gear I was guided by the saying "What could possibly go wrong?" Fortunately no issues. I also found the harmonic balancer was off two degrees, a small error, but for ignition timing it was worth correcting.

Looking forward to hearing you get it started.

BTW after I torque the heads in increments, I wait about a day and smack the heads with a rubber hammer and then re-check the torque. Usually no change, but once in a while one is off. I assume you know all about the fiasco of GM changing the Corvair head torque values during the production years. Now the folks that I've come to trust say 30 FT LBS WITH CLEAN, BUT NOT LUBED THREADS (using WD-40 to clean the threads is fine if you let it evaporate). That is what I use an so far no head gasket issues.

[Dennis66]

I figured that Clark's had good reason to put adding never seize in their instructions. I looked around today and did find other mention of it on other forums. I'm using copper gaskets. I was never a fan of the steel gaskets. Valve guides are good and tight, they are obviously new. Again, I believe this engine was redone, just not redone correctly. One possible reason the combustion chambers were so black when I first opened it up could be that valves weren't seating properly. They may have staked the seats and not cut them afterwards . Yes, I also believe in torquing in steps. I'll probably torque them down tomorrow, and then check everything on Tuesday afternoon. I don't recall seeing anything about "re-torquing" after a certain number of miles. On the Greenbrier, I did retorque after a few runs. Can't say I remember if there were any that were loose or not. On that one, I bought a 13/16 crowsfoot so I wouldn't have to remove the rockers. Kind of tricky, but it worked.
Degreeing the cam. Well, I carefully lined up the timing marks when I assembled the bottom end. Rolled it a couple of times and everything was lined up correctly, so I buttoned it up. Currently have the distributor in the hole, but I know it is a tooth off. I'll rectify that before I start putting push rods and rockers on (will use distributor to verify which cylinder is on firing (yes, manual has directions for #1 and 180, but I like to make sure. Distributor will eventually have to come back out for oil pump priming. Was going to try to do a little today, but just too hot (have to see a movie with daughter and her hubby this evening).
Might be going "Corvair scrounging" tomorrow. Some weeks back a guy listed a '63 Spyder convertible on craigslist for parts (non Spyder engine, rusted out rear floors, and front panel caved in somewhat and NO TITLE). He was asking 750 for the package that did include the Spyder engine, a second "164" engine, and some other stuff. I considered groveling to the wife for permission to buy, but timing wasn't good. A small boneyard has the car now and is parting it (dash went fast ). There are a few things I'd like, we'll see how that pans out. Here's the valve seat cutter. Note that the pilot isn't all the way down in the head shot. The guides in these 110 heads are also good and tight, and because of sitting, will need some cleaning before being used. The cutter I chose, cam have the bars adjusted so I can cut intake or exhaust seats. It probably wouldn't go far enough to do 140 intakes, that would take the next size up. I use dot use these cutters a lot doing valve jobs on small flat head engines. Dennis

Neway Valve seat cutter

Cutter in 110 head

[66vairguy]

Sounds like you are making good progress. I did not mean to suggest checking the head torque after the engine is first run. I do it while still on the bench the next day. Usually fine, but once it was off. Never hurts to double check.

I've stayed with the "crushable" steel gaskets. I read several comments over the years. If you need a thicker gasket then you have to go with the copper, but as far as reliable sealing both seem to work fine. If you overheat an engine, neither type seems to hold up well. Sometimes folks install the steel crushable gaskets upside down. Not good.

Neither steel or copper is re-usable, although some "anneal" the copper gaskets claiming that allows them to be reused. Considering the aggravation of replacing a leaking head gasket vs. cost, I replace them every time I pull a head. Just me.

[Dennis66]

So a full day of Corvair scrounging yesterday, and no time to comment. It went like this: 11:00 showed up at the yard to pick the bones of the Spyder convertible. The poor little car had seen better days - rusted out everywhere. I grabbed the spare tire mount (mine never had one (?), that air cleaner assembly (not exactly the one I wanted, but everything including the cylinder head stands, carb clips, both cans and caps, and the crossover tube), a spare 4 lug rim, and yet to be described parts for "future project X". Hotter than blazes, but fortunately the car was one of few under a tree.
I had already called the previous owner, who still had the two engines. They were located about 20 miles away, so I figured "make a day out of it". Drove over and checked them out. Riveted pulleys made me think 145s. Magnesium fans on both. One with carbs mounted, one with the turbo and crossover removed. The "turbo" engine was able to turn with a breaker, but the carb engine wouldn't turn. Ended up getting them both for 100.00. At this point, the Corvair thing could become a disease. On getting home and unloading, the following was determined (this is strange). Free engine is a T0218YN. It has 3819876 heads on it, BUT it has the oil return tube for the turbo. Numbers indicate this should be a 102HP, and heads SHOULD be for a 64 110HP. But what about the turbo drain?????? Locked engine is a TI203YR (turbo 150?) and the visible head is a 3813516 (102 head). Haven't checked the other head yet, still has the tin on it. I'm thinking maybe someone switched the 102 heads to turbo block. Still trying to figure out the "110" head with the turbo drain. Dennis

[Dennis66]

Here's today's update: I already knew that the turbo was free and wasn't stuck. They are 110 heads. I took a close look at the drain tube and it was just stuck in a hole that had been drilled in the head. While it's been a LONG time since my first driver Corvair that had Spyder heads, I just thought something didn't quite look right. I also forgot that the heads had choke rods sticking out, which I thought "Why chokes on Spyder heads?". I certainly hope someone didn't try to run a turbo on a 102 block using 110 heads. IIRC the 150 and 180 had forged pistons (but I could be wrong). Either way, I come out good on this deal. I'm thinking about pulling the 102 heads off the stuck engine and see what they look like. If they look good, and the valve guides are tight, I may put my valves in these and use them. They could be better than my current staked heads - which I haven't yet torqued down. Dennis

[66vairguy]

Here's today's update: I already knew that the turbo was free and wasn't stuck. They are 110 heads. I took a close look at the drain tube and it was just stuck in a hole that had been drilled in the head. While it's been a LONG time since my first driver Corvair that had Spyder heads, I just thought something didn't quite look right. I also forgot that the heads had choke rods sticking out, which I thought "Why chokes on Spyder heads?". I certainly hope someone didn't try to run a turbo on a 102 block using 110 heads. IIRC the 150 and 180 had forged pistons (but I could be wrong). Either way, I come out good on this deal. I'm thinking about pulling the 102 heads off the stuck engine and see what they look like. If they look good, and the valve guides are tight, I may put my valves in these and use them. They could be better than my current staked heads - which I haven't yet torqued down. Dennis

Nope, no forged pistons in any of the factory turbo engines and yes the factory cast pistons could be a problem. If you abused the engine, used low octane fuel, or did not keep the timing where it was specified, then pistons failed. That said history does not suggest it was a serious issue.

The turbo head discussion is full of opinions! Some insist the cars are less prone to detonation with the standard low compression heads, although the turbo heads tended to get better valves and some say a three angle valve seat grind (I'm not sure). I've also seen folks put 110HP and 140HP heads on turbo engines with the turbo!!! This seems like folly, but folks do it. Although Oldsmobile's JetFire had a high compression turbo engine (and it worked until the gizmo's quit) it wasn't until the age of computers and fuel injection and sophisticated ignition timing that higher compression turbo charging became practical.

[Dennis66]

So yesterday I spent a little time pulling the distributor, carbs, exhaust manifolds, and tin from the locked up (Spyder) engine. Today, I wheeled it to the driveway, stood it on the bellhousing, and heated the whole thing up good with my roofing torch. I let it cool a bit and sprayed it down with gunk. let that soak in a bit and pressure washed the whole thing. It was one grungy engine. After pressure washing, it now has a oil leak where the pan is pitted (there's only residual oil in it). I looked at the top head bolts and they look bad. Got a breaker bar and a 9/16 six point and the first nut came right off. I tried one nut on the opposite side and the stud came out. Tomorrow, I'll pull the valve covers and rockers and go through the whole sequence. If I thought this engine was bad, wait until the next one. This one did not have the lower tins (under the exhaust manifolds). The other one does, and I can see the dead skeleton of something down in there.

kind of clean now

Oh, BTW. The carbs that came off this both still had their tags and both have the little idle compensators on the bottom.

[Dennis66]

Today's progress: I finally go the engine compartment painted - kind of. I had taped everything off yesterday, but didn't have time to shoot it. Today started out with "reaasonable" weather, so I rounded everything up and gave it a shot (pun intended). This was my first time shooting white or a solid color from TCP and it was a learning experience. In the past, I've always had to thin their paint, sometimes up to 50% to get it to shoot good. This stuff was thin. I initially mixed up 8 ounces, but quickly realized it was going to take a lot more. I went ahead and mixed another 16 ounces. It went on thin, and didn't cover so well. It also had a very gray appearance. It was kind of difficult trying to get all around the engine compartment and not get into any of the wet paint (I was shooting under a "pop up" canopy) After it was all done, I noticed some runs, so I most likely will end up doing some sanding and giving it another coat. I did also spray part of the underside of the hood, so that will need another good coat as well. I also still need to clean up, prep and prime the hood hinges.
After painting, I got into the seized up Spyder engine. My intention had been to remove the 102 HP heads, tear them down, and possibly use those on my 102 engine. Getting them off was quite a task. Reminded me of tearing down trashed engines back in high school. In the end, one head is useable, the left one is junk. #1 had been the cylinder that was seized. Not only was it full of funk, the corrosion had eaten into the surface of th ecombustion chamber and between the cast iron cylinder, copper head gasket, and aluminum head, it even ate into the head sealing surface. I still have th eother engine and a ton of good parts, so I'm not hurt on the deal. Dennis

First coats

corroded head