62 Monza no lights

[VairsRule]

» Sun Nov 11, 2018 10:26 pm

...It's odd that the new backup light wiring does not work in place, but works fine when connected directly to the battery, and that half of it worked in place before...

Although I cannot be there to examine your actual wiring, your description makes it sound like there must be a voltage drop somewhere between your reconnect point and the voltage source. But when you bypass the rest of the harness by connecting directly to the battery terminal your new wiring is functional. If it stops working when you connect the wire back to the multi-connector, then the voltage drop must exist internally within the multi-connector or at some point on the other side of the wiring harness as it is routed to the voltage source. A bad wire or a bad connection anywhere in the path between your reconnection point and the battery could be causing a reduction in voltage or an open condition that is preventing the complete circuit from functioning. The trick is to find the location of the high resistance or open condition that is causing the circuit to fail. Testing your wiring by connecting it directly to the battery terminal only proves the quality of your new wiring. But reconnecting that same new wiring back to the original source on the wiring harness, and then having it fail to function, only proves that you have more problems further down the pipe. The wiring you replaced may have indeed been faulty, but then reconnecting the new wiring to the old wiring harness only verifies the poor condition of the wiring harness throughout the car. Sounds like you're facing a complex and time-consuming task to restore the wiring throughout your car to an original working condition. A complete fix may be costly, either in time or money, or both. I am not sure what has caused such extensive deterioration in your Corvair wiring harness. Most aging Corvairs do not suffer from such an extensive breakdown in electrical wiring.

I have not had much trouble with Corvair wiring, except a few cases where someone patched it poorly, and this car had almost no rust. If it had salt corrosion, I would expect corroded wiring, but other than the rear harness (which appears to have been damaged due to somebody doing some really dumb things that caused them to get hot/burn), all the wiring I've looked at has been fine. Even the fuse panel is in better condition that other, newer vairs I've owned. I have never had any wires on a vehicle chewed by animals, not even in a couple of cases where mice or a rat lived in the car for awhile, so I doubt any of the wires on this car have been chewed. I think it's likely that the remaining causes are simply due to light corrosion at connection points from the car sitting for so long.

I took another look at the wiring diagram you posted. Am trying to trace the path of the wires and points where I can do tests along the line, specifically, the power source to the backup light switch (where does this original from?) and the wire between backup light switch and engine harness plug. It shows a 14 guage light green wire

This diagram shows a BACK UP LAMP SWITCH, but in parentheses, it says "(Auto Trans.)". I wonder why? It's it a single pole switch in either case? Of course, the schematic does not show the PHYSICAL LOCATION of anything, so finding things on the car can be a challenge.

The schematic shows what appear to be two MORE harness plugs, each with 6 sets of terminals, to the left of the BACKUP LAMP SWITCH. There are "loops" around the wires leading to/from these plugs that indicate they are together. One "loop" says "WIRING HARNESS ASM. INST PANEL", and the other says "WIRING HARNESS ASM. MAIN". I assume the first is on the back of the instrument cluster (which I have not been able to remove yet). On the schematic, they are side-by-side. Are they BOTH in the back of the instrument cluster? I have not seen anything that looks like them.

[VairsRule]

Bought a new signal flasher and dimmer switch and got my garage jack out of storage in case I have to get under the car. Work under the car is a big challenge for me physically, so knowing what is where before I crawl under there would be a great help. Hoping I won't have to remove the big metal cover that protects the "chaseway" that runs down the middle of the car.

Got the following results for the new signal flasher: In "left" position, I hear the relay inside it click once, but no lights. In the "right" position, nothing happens (no click, no lights). All 4 tail lights are in place with good bulbs. Was not surprised that this did not fix the turn signals.

Did not have time to replace the dimmer switch. It's mounted with some weird bolts I don't recognize. These are probably going to be a hassle to remove.

[bbodie52]

The following diagram depicts the manual transmission backup light switch and wiring harness...



Clark's uses the 3-speed tunnel switch for their "Fix-It Kit" if you were to choose to abandon the vulnerable switch on the bottom of the 4-speed transmission. (A damaged switch can be bypassed and abandoned, but must remain in-place to plug the hole and prevent oil leakage).

...This diagram shows a BACK UP LAMP SWITCH, but in parentheses, it says "(Auto Trans.)". I wonder why?

I noticed that too, and made a correction a few days ago (1962 schematic diagram only)...

Left-click image to enlarge, and a second time for maximum enlargement...

1962 Passenger Car Combined Schematic (Rev. A)

The above diagram will show the wiring and fuse block power source for either backup light switch — the Powerglide transmission switch under the instrument panel (attached to the shift lever), and the manual transmission switch on the bottom of the four-speed transmission. (The switch for the three-speed manual transmission is hidden inside the tunnel, and attached to the shift rod linkage).

3-Speed Transmission Backup Light Switch Replacement

Replacement switches are available through Clark's Corvair Parts...


http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/catalog ... N&page=84B

Part number C5364: 61-65 4SP BACK-UP SWITCH *EXACT REPRO BOOT & GASKET (C383A) INCLUDED

Weight: 0 lbs 10 oz
Catalog Pages(s): 84B
Price: $ 53.50

...Did not have time to replace the dimmer switch. It's mounted with some weird bolts I don't recognize. These are probably going to be a hassle to remove.

I'm just guessing... are they clutch head screws?



This is a special type of screw that prevents tampering. A clutch head tool is needed. Not sure of the size. I cannot find any mention of these in the Clark's catalog, GM Parts catalog, or shop manual.

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i ... JGRUVLHCKK

[VairsRule]

Yes, they are clutch head screws. Found I have one of these bits. It's one size too small, but was able to replace the dimmer switch. Had to drill one of the two mounting holes bigger to get the screw in it, despite it being a slot on that side. The ears were also twice as thick as on the old one, but there was enough thread to mount it. There was rope caulk under/around the old switch that I doubt was put there by the factory, but I left it alone. Used dielectric grease. The headlights now work correctly.

As mentioned before, the turn signals still don't work with the new flasher relay.

Pretty sure the backup light switch on this car (it's a 4-speed) is OK, but will inspect it when I get the car up on jack stands. I traced the power source in red using your revised schematic. Do not recall seeing this or the wire next to it when I had the fuse panel down the other day. Will take a look tomorrow.

[joelsplace]

All the early model turn signal problems I've had I managed to fix by fixing the rear housing grounds and cleaning/lubricating the switch. Not counting bulbs of course.
Just remembered I had a defective tail light assembly once that had the wires shorted inside the grommet where it went through the body. Factory defect. There wasn't enough space between the two blades in the rubber and they eventually touched.

[VairsRule]

All the early model turn signal problems I've had I managed to fix by fixing the rear housing grounds and cleaning/lubricating the switch. Not counting bulbs of course.
Just remembered I had a defective tail light assembly once that had the wires shorted inside the grommet where it went through the body. Factory defect. There wasn't enough space between the two blades in the rubber and they eventually touched.

How did you clean and lubricate the turn signal switch? Did you remove the switch and open it up?

My left/rear tail light had broken wires. I soldered new wire on and put shrink tubing over the end. But now the springs in the pigtails are not pushing against the bulb. I think it's the shrink tubing. Need to take it apart and redo it. But it WAS working until a couple of days ago. Now no tail lights...

[joelsplace]

Yes, I took it apart, cleaned out the old grease and polished the contacts. It just has metal tabs that bend over to hold it together. Small springs exert force on the contacts so don't lose them. It isn't complicated.

[VairsRule]

Yes, I took it apart, cleaned out the old grease and polished the contacts. It just has metal tabs that bend over to hold it together. Small springs exert force on the contacts so don't lose them. It isn't complicated.

Sounds a lot like the light switch. Speaking of light switches, the shaft keeps pulling out of mine since I put it back together. I put a little anti-seize compound on the tip because it would not go back in all the way, but now it won't stay in, lol.

[joelsplace]

Yes the design is very similar to the light switch. If I remember correctly it has 2 sliding contacts with 3 strip contacts under each one. My memory isn't great so that may be way off.
I've heard it is easy to jam or damage the catch for the head light switch.

[VairsRule]

I was very careful with the headlight switch, and verified that the metal part that catches onto the end of the switch shaft was not bend or worn at all.

What I did today:

Removed driver door light switch. This switch is missing the spring needed to turn the dome light on when door opened, but is otherwise intact. The wire to it had some wire showing through the insulation (wanted to put shrink tubing over it, but could not get the connector on the other end to come apart). I tried putting a ballpoint pen spring on it, but could not get it to turn onto the shaft (too little room, bad angle).

Jacked the left/rear side of car up and inspected wiring. The backup light switch is NEW. I pulled the rubber boot and verified that the two wires are firmly attached to the switch and have the black rubber tubing on them. However, the new wires are just twiested onto the old wires and some electrical tape slapped on. Most of the tape had come off (I removed it). The wires still look bright and are twisted together well enough (this is NOT the reason backup lights don't work at all since redoing the rear wiring to the backup lights). The are also two bundles of wires that go into the cable chase where the backup light switch wires are connected. These bundles are bonded together somehow, instead of having any kind of tape wrape on them. They appear to be completely intact.

I still don't know where these two harness plugs identified on the wiring diagram as "WIRING HARNESS ASM. - MAIN" and "WIRING HARNESS ASM. INST. PANEL" ARE physically located, nor what they look like. I did not remove any of the chaseway cover plates under the car to see if there are any harness plugs inside, but I doubt there would be. Where are these??? BTW, the '64 wiring diagrams shows these joined together into one big junction block or plug.

[joelsplace]

The instrument panel harness connector is right of the instrument panel to the left of the radio close to the speaker.

[VairsRule]

The instrument panel harness connector is right of the instrument panel to the left of the radio close to the speaker.

Thanks!

[VairsRule]

OK, I found the two harness plugs under the dash, but was unable to get either of them to unplug with pulling and wiggling. There is nothing on the plugs to use to lever them apart. Considered putting a small c-clamp on one side to lever against, or grabbing it with Channelocks, but decided to see if you guys know a trick to getting these to separate without breaking the plug? :-\

[terribleted]

Usually you just have to hold the little end latches squeezed in so they are released and wiggle both sides while keeping them squeezed.

[VairsRule]

Usually you just have to hold the little end latches squeezed in so they are released and wiggle both sides while keeping them squeezed.

These plugs don't have any end latches. They are black plastic and rather thick, but otherwise similar to the engine harness plug. There is nothing to pry against to separate the two halves. Guess I'll try putting a small c-clamp on the smaller plug to have something to lever against.

[terribleted]

Oops was thinking about the wrong plug/year perhaps. You are talking about the 2 plugs where the main harness hooks to the dash and fuse harnesses right? These plugs have no locks. They just push and pull apart. Try lubing with some silicon spray or perhaps a break free type spray (PB Blaster etc.) and pull and wiggle is all I can suggest. I have never had a big issue separating these even on harnesses I am replacing because they are nasty and corroded. Good luck. With all the issues you have been having , if it was me I would likely just replace the harness front to back. No more issues in my lifetime:)