ARTICLE: IS THE CHEVY CORVAIR CONSIDERED A 'CLASSIC,' AND HOW MUCH IS ONE WORTH TODAY?

[bbodie52]

Here is another Corvair article from SlashGear...

CARS
IS THE CHEVY CORVAIR CONSIDERED A 'CLASSIC,' AND HOW MUCH IS ONE WORTH TODAY?
BY ELI SHAYOTOVICHNOV. 18, 2024 10:00 AM EST

Read More: https://www.slashgear.com/1714301/chevr ... assic-car/



The Chevrolet Corvair was a rear-engine car manufactured between 1960 and 1969, becoming GM's first vehicle powered by an all-aluminum, air-cooled, flat-six engine. It also happened to be the first Detroit-built car with a unibody design. Since the engine was in the back, all of the car's weight sat behind the rear swing axle, giving it the propensity to spin out and potentially roll over.

Making matters worse, in 1965, political activist and consumer advocate Ralph Nader released a book called "Unsafe at Any Speed" wherein he took GM to task for Corvair's safety issues and extrapolated that to claim the entire automobile industry had a complete and total disregard for public safety as a whole when it came to designing vehicles. This book was instrumental in passing the National Traffic and Motor Vehicle Safety Act in 1966, which allowed the government to create a legion of safety standards that the entire automobile industry had to follow if they wanted to sell cars in the United States.

Even as recently as 2017, the Corvair made it onto Time Magazine's list of "50 Worst Cars of All Time," citing the spinning-out problem along with other issues, like a single-piece steering column capable of skewering the driver, constant oil leaks, and a heating system that blew harmful engine fumes into the main cabin. Despite all those problems, "Car and Driver" called it a "poor man's Porsche" during a 1963 road test, and it's now considered a "classic car" in most collector circles.

A Detroit-made rear engine classic



What's a "classic" car? The Classic Car Club of America (CCCA) has very stringent requirements – the vehicle had to be built between 1915 and 1948 and can't be "mass-produced" on an assembly line. Meanwhile, both Hagerty and American Collector Insurance require a car to be at least 20 years old, but that doesn't necessarily make it a "classic" per se. Thus, the definition is wholly subjective and depends on what your state laws, insurance company, or car club have to say.

The Corvair had several things going for it that make it a "classic" — besides its age. It boasted Chevrolet's interesting flat-six engine (aka Turbo-Air 6) and was GM's first unibody production car. The first-generation Corvairs (1960 to 1964) used a swing axle rear suspension (like a Volkswagen Bug), but the second-generation models (1965 to 1969) fixed the roll problem by installing a fully independent rear suspension. Additional models introduced exhaust gas-driven turbocharging.

What's more, it came in various body styles, including a sedan, convertible, coupe, wagon, and even a van. The MSRP for a 1960 Chevrolet Corvair 500 4-door sedan was $2,038. The sportier Monza (1961) had bucket seats and a floor shifter with an MSRP starting around $2,200, making it a fun, affordable, economical car. A convertible arrived in '62 (MSRP of $2,483), along with a new turbocharged Spyder, an option package available only on Monzas for an extra $421.95. By comparison, a '62 Porsche 356B retailed for $4,289, making it as close as the average American working Joe got to a Porsche.

What are they worth today?



Another notable feature appeared in the second-generation Corvair released in 1965 – a sculpted "character line" wrapped around the entire car. This crease ran through the fenders, doors, and fascias, adding personality to the vehicle. It was a styling detail that virtually every automobile manufacturer quickly adopted.

While the charming first-gen Corvairs have more historical significance thanks to all of their firsts, the second generation of vehicles is considered more collectible. The value hinges primarily on the usual suspects of condition and mileage but really depends on which Corvair model you're seeking.

The latest data from Classic.com shows that although total sales for both generations are relatively close (205 first gens compared to 226 second gens sold over the last five years), the dollar amounts do differ. First gens sell for an average of $13,669 (with a high sale topping out at $47,300), while second gens average $18,205 (and had a high sale of $82,500) — but with a caveat. Three of the four second-generation cars that sold north of $60,000 were special COPO Yenko Stingers, a special Corvair modified by Chevrolet's central office with additional tweaks completed by Yenko Chevrolet built to compete in SCCA (Sports Car Club of America) racing.

Convertibles led the pack in sales over the last five years for both generations. The Monza Spyder (which was driven by Andrea Braugher in "Brooklyn Nine-Nine") is the typical high-dollar earner for first-gen Corvairs, and the Corsa and Monza models often sell well north of the $18k average for second-gen models.

Beauty and value are in the eye of the beholder



Then you have the much rarer pickup and van models, both part of the "Corvair 95" family. The truck was available from 1961 until 1964 and came in two versions, a "Rampside" that — as the name implies — had a side opening ramp, and a "Loadside" that came with a standard rear tailgate, but which was interestingly the rarer of the two. Meanwhile, the Greenbrier van was sold between '61 and '65 and came in six or eight-door versions.

Most of the trucks sold over the last five years were the "Rampside" model, with an average sale price of $28,046, substantially higher than the average sale prices of coupes, convertibles, and sedans. In fact, the top sale price for a '63 Rampside (keep in mind only 55 have sold since 2019, according to Classic.com) went for $88,000 in May 2020, eclipsing even a Yenko Stinger. A mere 18 vans have sold in five years, earning an average sale price of $22,684, but with one topping out at $103,400.

One last thing to keep in mind: Back in October 1964, the prestigious automobile magazine "Car and Driver" went on record saying, " ... the Corvair is in our opinion — the most important new car of the entire crop of '65 models, and the most beautiful car to appear in this country since before World War II." The Corvair is one of the vehicles we think Chevy never should've discontinued, and there's no shortage of them available for sale across a wide range of price points to suit any level of interest.

[Doug Ward]

I believe the term " Poor man's Porsche" should be corrected to say that the "Porsche is a rich man's Corvair" since the Corvair air cooled flat 6 boxer preceded the 6 cyl Porsche by 3 to 4 years.

[66vairguy]

I believe the term " Poor man's Porsche" should be corrected to say that the "Porsche is a rich man's Corvair" since the Corvair air cooled flat 6 boxer preceded the 6 cyl Porsche by 3 to 4 years.

A good turn of words! Yes the Corvair six design preceded the Porsche six design. For years "stories" noted that Porsche personnel were at GM to "help" Chevrolet build the Corvair engine. In fact at the time Porsche was a relatively small company compared to the GM juggernaut. GM often allowed small "foreign" automobile manufactures to visit and learn as small manufacturers were not seen as an immediate threat (that would change as history has shown).

In fact it might have been the other way around as there are pictures of Corvairs parked outside of a Porsche facility (not sure where), but that is just speculation. A good "story" (not sure if any of it is true) suggests the first Porsche prototype flat air cooled six used the same number of crank main bearings as the Corvair engine and Porsche discovered the infamous harmonic problem noted by Chevrolet engineer Mr. Benzinger that resulted in the unique Corvair three piece "flex" flywheel. Porsche abandoned the design and increased the number of crankshaft main bearings.

Now before someone gets all uptight about the Corvair engine design, note it was originally meant to be about a 90HP engine and ended up in a 180HP version with no major design changes. That says a lot about how robust the original design was!!!! Also don't beat up the Corvair engineers about the flywheel design. As Mr. Benzinger stated - from the beginning management insisted the Corvair would ONLY be sold with an automatic since demand for manual transmissions was low. Logical as it reduced tooling costs, but of course buyers are IRRATIONAL. When GM found out the Ford Falcon was less expensive to build it shocked GM management. Even worse Ford and Chrysler followed their big car practice with their compacts by making a manual standard and charging a hefty premium for an automatic transmission!! Suddenly the Corvair base price WITH the automatic was unattractive to buyers compared to a Falcon or Valiant. Oh sure one could say "We don't charge extra for the automatic", but that does not work with irrational folks as they just look (at the time) in the ads and see the huge print size with the LOWER price. Lets be honest, we all look at the base price, but most order the extras!!!! The marketing folks are well aware this works (still does).

So Mr. Benzinger and associates were told "put in a manual transmission so the automatic is an option". This was AFTER the primary tooling was done on the engine!!!! What could have been a disaster (and no manual Corvair transmission ) was solved by the creative and unique Corvair three piece flywheel. Note Mr. Benzinger spoke about this at a CORSA convention and it was transcribed and is still available to read.

Sometimes reading about the Corvair is a much fun as driving one.

[NMVair]

Judging by the amount of comments I get on my car, I think it's a classic.
And man are there some great lines in this posting.
Reading about Corvairs IS fun, but not as fun as driving them.
And ....and porche is a rich man's Corvair.

These are classics!!!

I never liked the comparison to the Beetle, because the Stones were much better than them.

[66vairguy]

I never liked the comparison to the Beetle, because the Stones were much better than them.

I will have to remember your line -

[NMVair]

I hope this thread never dies. Corvairs are hard to price for me. Maybe we should put a bunch I of mitigating factors and put it in an algorithm. If people could share honestly what they paid and sold for. ......maybe we'd have an understanding.
IDK
I know one thing, I was watching a video about the history of the corvair you know with the Ralp Nader thing and all and it was well made. I thought it would make a good Hollywood movie really.

[NMVair]

Theres a 64out on the Jemez Indian reservation that is pretty strait and complete. It sits back in a field going to waste. The engine has a serious pile of dirt right on top of it. My guess a pack rat.
In any event the owner wouldn't give me a price so I offered 700.
Whatever. He seemed insulted saying it was a classic yadi yadi
So I guess to him, his rat infested, dirt pile engine 64 is a classic.
All I know is I tried and that car is going to be a problem.

[NMVair]

I mouse house stuff.

[Wittsend]

"... It also happened to be the first Detroit-built car with a unibody design..."

"Detroit" seems a broad used term in this article. According to the internet the Corvair was the first GM unibody. However, the 1941 Nash 600 was the first USA manufactured unibody and the 1923 Lancia Lambda was the first WORLD unibody.

It could be argued that the Nash (and other pre-1960 AMC unibody cars) were made in Kenosha, Wisconsin but it can also be argued that Willow Run isn't exactly Detroit. That and the unibody Ford Falcon and Dodge/Plymouth Valiant/Lancer were introduced in relative proximity to the Corvair. But I guess if there are "split hairs" that is why some people flew to far flung edges on the international date line to welcome in the new Millennium.

So, yes, the Corvair was the first of the Big Three (which at times are referred to collectively as "Detroit" - regardless of where the cars were built) but unibody cars had been around for some time prior. Thus it would read more accurate if the statement was '... the first GM-built unibody design... .'

[66vairguy]

"... It also happened to be the first Detroit-built car with a unibody design..."

"Detroit" seems a broad used term in this article. According to the internet the Corvair was the first GM unibody. However, the 1941 Nash 600 was the first USA manufactured unibody and the 1923 Lancia Lambda was the first WORLD unibody.

It could be argued that the Nash (and other pre-1960 AMC unibody cars) were made in Kenosha, Wisconsin but it can also be argued that Willow Run isn't exactly Detroit. That and the unibody Ford Falcon and Dodge/Plymouth Valiant/Lancer were introduced in relative proximity to the Corvair. But I guess if there are "split hairs" that is why some people flew to far flung edges on the international date line to welcome in the new Millennium.

So, yes, the Corvair was the first of the Big Three (which at times are referred to collectively as "Detroit" - regardless of where the cars were built) but unibody cars had been around for some time prior. Thus it would read more accurate if the statement was '... the first GM-built unibody design... .'

Thanks for posting that. Also "UNIBODY" is a term applied to different body designs. The Hudson was a combination of unibody and braces construction that allowed for the low floor pan (and lower center of gravity that made the Hudson a race winner). The Camaro was a unibody with front subframe and bolt on front fenders.

[NMVair]

$5k
Wanna see the rest of the car? It's just as bad.
Or he's going to take it to the metal crusher.