Oil leak

[Blair]

The smoke comes out of these places. The pcv hose always, the fuel pump when I take it out, and on the passenger side underneath everything. Around the same spot as the oil cooler except on the other side. When I take out the top part of the fuel pump, less comes out of the PCV hose. when I put it back in, more comes out. Smoke also comes out from the engine itself, from under the sheet metal. I did not check for vacuum leaks because I didn't have a lot of time. I want to get this figured out by the end of this weekend. You guys have given me a lot of useful tips on this and I always refer back to this website when I need it. So thanks a lot. This is my first car I've started restoring and it's a lot of fun. I'm great with body work and interior but you guys are helping me with more of the mechanical side. So thanks for the feedback

[bbodie52]

Sun Sep 24, 2017 9:58 pm

So I finally got my 64 monza running and I have an oil leak and can't seem to find where it's coming from. Is the part directly below the oil cap in the picture the oil pump? I took it off and found small pieces of metal in it. I know that is not a good thing at all. It runs great after i replaced a carb. But after driving or having it run just 5 minutes it starts smoking from into the center air filter and just everywhere. I want to fix this oil leak but I don't know where its coming friom and I want to finally be able to take it on the road

The information you provided is very limited, but I will try to answer your questions…

The part directly below the oil cap is the mechanical fuel pump. I'm not sure which you are saying when you said that you removed the fuel pump and found small pieces of metal in it?

FYI — the oil pump consists of a pair of special pump gears that are installed in the bottom of the rear housing. The pump is located at the base of the long distributor shaft that extends diagonally from the distributor, past the crankshaft pulley, and terminates at the oil pump gearset. The engine oil pump is driven by the distributor shaft, with the ignition system distributor at one end of the shaft and the oil pump gearset at the bottom end of the distributor shaft.

Did you remove the air filter cover to see where the smoke that you described is coming from? The smoke may be coming from the Positive Crankcase Ventilation (PCV) system. In the two illustrations below you can see the PCV tube that comes up from the engine and terminates in the air cleaner assembly. There is also a vacuum hose that connects to the side of this tube. The PCV system removes crankcase fumes and gases from the crankcase. These gases are a normal part of engine operation. Called BLOW-BY, the gases accumulate in the engine crankcase as they leak past the pistons and piston rings. The crankcase is a sealed chamber, and the PCV system is intended to remove the blow-by gases and circulate them back through the intake system. The gases are then drawn into the combustion chambers, burned as a part of the combustion process, and then exit the engine via the exhaust system.

If your PCV system is clogged or dirty it may not be removing these gases properly. Normally, many of the gases are sucked from the PCV tube via the vacuum hose that attaches to the vacuum balance tube that connects between the two carburetors. There is a fixed orifice hole where the hose connects to the PCV tube, and this fixed orifice hole can become dirty and clogged. If this is the case with your PCV system you may need to remove the air cleaner and disconnect the vacuum hose from the PCV tube so that you can clean any obstructions in the fixed orifice. Any remaining gases that are not drawn back into the engine through the vacuum hose exit the PCV tube and into the air cleaner, where they are supposed to be drawn back through the carburetor intakes.

Excessive crankcase pressure buildup can cause oil to be forced from the crankcase and into the PCV tube or through the oil dipstick tube as the pressure buildup seeks a way to exit the crankcase. Hopefully your problem is simply a dirty PCV system and can be resolved by cleaning the PCV system and ensuring that it is properly connected to the engine.

A more detailed description and possibly photographs to support your questions may help us to better understand the problems you are discovering so that we can suggest possible solutions.

The link below will provide you with a list of useful websites that are Corvair-related. Some of the links will lead you to an extensive technical library that will allow you to download shop manuals and other technical references in Adobe Reader format at no cost. There is also a link that will help you to locate nearby CORSA (Corvair Society of America) club chapters. While the Corvair Forum can be very helpful as you work on your Corvair, having local friends and contacts in your region who are knowledgeable about the Corvair can also be very helpful. These family-friendly CORSA chapters often offer picnics, group scenic drives, technical training and assistance, car shows, and competition events that can greatly enhance your enjoyment of Corvair ownership. You will also find a list of essential Corvair parts suppliers. Clark's Corvair Parts is the biggest and oldest Corvair supplier in the world. You will find a link that can provide you with a series of videos that amount to a tour of the Clark's Corvair Parts facilities. I think you will be amazed at the quality of the reproduction components they offer — particularly the interior carpeting and re-upholstery items. Parts suppliers such as this truly make our Corvair hobby possible.

Common and Useful Corvair Websites

viewtopic.php?f=225&t=6007

I would like to encourage you to expand on your initial post and tell us more about yourself. If you can describe your personal assessment of your mechanical skills and abilities, that would help a lot. Members of the Corvair Forum love to be helpful in assisting other Corvair owners with technical support and advice, but it helps a lot if we have some understanding of your technical background and mechanical abilities, Corvair-related knowledge, etc. Also, do you have a garage to work in and hand tools, jack stands and a floor jack, etc. to support Corvair maintenance? Helping us to know more about you will help us to write comments to you that are tailored to your needs and experience. Knowing your location is also useful, because knowing where you live can sometimes suggest possibilities.

[Blair]

It smokes out of the PCV tube but the engine gets really hot and seems to just smoke from everywhere. Other than the PCV tube, i cant locate where any of the smoke is coming from it just appears. I did some research and the part that i mentioned in my last post that i thought was an oil pump, was actually a fuel pump. The metal chunks I found in it were lodged in the spring. What I noticed, there were 2 holes in the side where bolts are supposed to go and they were missing. I bought some that fit the holes but I haven't put them in since I don't know what they are for yet. Also there is another hole for a bolt just below it, and that bolt is roughly the same size except it's fat at the top and skinny at the bottom. Could anyone tell me what it's for? I did some research on bad oil pumps.. it said it can give the car a high temperature and a strange sound. My corvair had almost all the symptoms I found. But could it be the cause of the oil leak as well? And the smoke? Just how difficult is it to replace an oil pump? And how long does it typically take?

[bbodie52]

So I finally got my 64 monza running...

The picture you provided shows what appears to be a very clean engine in good condition. But your opening comment indicates that you finally got your Corvair running. Can you provide some background information on this engine? What exactly was preventing it from running in the first place? Was it sitting for a very long time?

...What I noticed, there were 2 holes in the side where bolts are supposed to go and they were missing. I bought some that fit the holes but I haven't put them in since I don't know what they are for yet. Also there is another hole for a bolt just below it, and that bolt is roughly the same size except it's fat at the top and skinny at the bottom. Could anyone tell me what it's for?

The images below will give you a good cross-section view of the mechanical fuel pump, and a picture of the individual fuel pump components…




The fuel pump is held together by the screws on the top. The two holes on the side are the fuel inlet from the fuel tank and the fuel outlet that provides fuel to the carburetors. The hole in the side of the shaft at the bottom of the fuel pump is where the large bolt with the tapered end that secures the pump to the aluminum housing (oil filter adapter) fits into.

I did some research on bad oil pumps.. it said it can give the car a high temperature and a strange sound. My corvair had almost all the symptoms I found. But could it be the cause of the oil leak as well? And the smoke? Just how difficult is it to replace an oil pump? And how long does it typically take?

Generally, Corvair oil pumps are very reliable. A single gear on the distributor shaft is driven by the crankshaft. If that were to fail the oil pump would stop, but so with the distributor. The engine would immediately shut down.

Does the oil pressure warning light in the instrument panel come on when the key is turned to the ON position with the engine not running? This effectively tests the function of the warning light to ensure that it is working before you start the engine. If the light is on when the engine not running, and turns off when you start the engine, the oil pressure warning light switch is indicating the presence of oil pressure.

An overheating Corvair engine is also unusual. Most of the cooling system is passive in nature in that it is simply forced air moving past the cooling fins on the cylinder barrels and cylinder heads. As long as the cooling fan is being turned by the fan belt, an overheating Corvair engine would be unlikely to occur. However, an engine that has been sitting in a parked car for years can sometimes accumulate a large amount of debris under the sheet metal shroud as small animals crawl into the space and build nests from straw and other scraps of trash that they drag into the engine. Such a critter invasion might go unnoticed since most of the trash they bring into your engine is hidden under the sheet-metal. But as you can see in the photograph below the homes they build under the covers for their own creature comfort could quickly cause the Corvair engine to overheat. Is there any chance that such a buildup might exist under the sheet-metal on your engine?

[Blair]

Thanks for the information. The picture I provided originally is not my engine, mine is in decent looking but not that good. I plan on working on it this Friday and getting as much information as I can now. My corvair has been sitting for quite some time, the last inspection sticker in the window is from 2002. After I replaced the driver side carb it runs pretty well. In a way it sounds like a lawnmower, but I think it's just an exhaust problem. Before I order new parts I will check if it's the pcv tube or the vacuum tube that connects to it and clean it out. I would be very happy and lucky if that is the only issue. Also, i used 10w 30 oil in it. I ordered a oil filter and plan on changing the oil as well this weekend. I will drain the oil and i will inspect the drained oil for pieces of metal. While draining the oil, what else should I look for to indicate a bad oil pump or oil system? I'm trying to figure out the leak as well as the oil burning. I don't know why I found chunks of metal in the fuel pump though. Also, what type of oil would go best with my car? It's a 64 monza sedan. Inline 6 2.3 I believe. Maybe the type of oil I'm using could be the problem?

[Blair]

What do I have to remove to take the sheet metal off to clean the engine? I would imagine there's a few nests in there

[terribleted]

Sitting since 2002. You need to drain any fuel from the tank, blow out the lines and install new gasoline. You say you replaced 1 car....what about the other carb....both carbs are likely gunked up from sitting. The oil 10w30 is a recommended oil no issue there. Corvair engines will smoke up out of the shrouding if they are not clean. Any old oil caught in the shrouding will cook and smoke. removing the top and bottom shrouds gives pretty good access for inspection and cleaning. The lower R and L shrouds come off easily the top fan shroud is a bit more difficult requiring removal of fuel line and carbs to be easy. Check the oil pump pressure with a gauge you can temporarily install the gauge fitting in place of the oil pressure switch located to the left of the oil fill tube and oil cap. Be aware that Corvair engines run pretty well on one carb, you need to be sure that both are working for best results:)

[Blair]

The oil it's running seems clean by looking at the dipstick. The gas tank and gas lines are brand new. Maybe vacuum leak? Ill be working on it all weekend

[bbodie52]

Common and Useful Corvair Websites

viewtopic.php?f=225&t=6007

Do you have copies of the Corvair shop manuals? If you don't, you should definitely download the 1961 shop manual, the 1964 supplement, and a copy of the 1965 shop manual might also prove useful. I taught myself to remove the Corvair powertrain from a 1963 Corvair during my high school summer vacation when I was 16 years old in 1969. The Corvair shop manuals were my only guide, and I learned to never perform any task on the Corvair without first reading the appropriate sections of the shop manual. I always had those shop manuals close by, and I refered to them often as I was performing any tasks. This helped to minimize mistakes. I would strongly suggest that you use a similar approach. Members of the Corvair Forum generally like to be helpful and encouraging, but there is also an expectation that we are all working "off the same page". You should always do your homework by reviewing and following the Corvair shop manual. Then make use of the Corvair Forum for clarification and guidance when the shop manual procedure is confusing or not clear to you. The link above can be used to download many useful technical references that you should have on hand on your computer. Hard copies can also be purchased from sources like Clark's Corvair Parts, or you can print out pages as you need them. You can save yourself money and probably a lot of grief if you develop the habit of making full use of the available technical references and advice on the Corvair Forum. Almost all Corvair enthusiasts and mechanics on the Corvair Forum follow the same practices, no matter how experienced they are in working with Corvairs.

Posting a picture of an engine that is not yours can be confusing and misleading to members of the Corvair forum. Providing support via the Internet mandates careful communication in words and photographs to avoid misleading or confusing advice and so that the best possible support can be provided to you. If possible I would recommend that you post close-up and detailed pictures of your engine compartment and other areas of your Corvair that you intend to work on. Sometimes a photograph of your engine may make it possible for experienced mechanics to spot trouble areas that you may not even be aware of.

A picture is worth a thousand words.

viewtopic.php?f=225&t=5030

What do I have to remove to take the sheet metal off to clean the engine? I would imagine there's a few nests in there.

See page 6a-14 of the attached 1961 Chevrolet Corvair Shop Manual - Section 6a - Engine. The attached 1964 Supplement - Chevrolet Corvair Shop Manual - Section 6a - Engine also provides useful guidance and illustrations. The section from the 1965 Corvair Chassis Shop Manual that is attached will also provide useful guidance, but the perimeter sheet-metal is a little different from that found in 1964 and earlier cars.

All of these attachments are simply extracted sections of the overall shop manuals. The complete shop manuals and supplements, and many other Corvair guides and technical manuals can all be downloaded using the link that I provided at the beginning of this post.

[64powerglide]

Check that oil cooler.

[Blair]

Could you also tell me exactly where the vacuum tubes are located?

[bbodie52]

The actual vacuum connections depend on the model year, transmission type, Instrument Panel configuration (Spyder, Corsa, Monza), etc.

Vacuum Balance Tube Example

Vacuum Balance Tube Cylinder Head Connction

Powerglide Vacuum Modulator

[Blair]

Thank you guys so much for the information. The pictures and diagrams are very helpful. The vacuum tube was disconnected the whole time. I put it back on and the car doesn't smoke nearly as much. I'm about to go out and check if the gasket is still good and for other vacuum leaks from the modulator. I think I've found the source of the oil leak as well. Are the seals around the oil pan made out of cork? That's what it looks like to me. I bought this stuff that supposedly you can make your own gaskets.

[bbodie52]

...The vacuum tube was disconnected the whole time. I put it back on and the car doesn't smoke nearly as much...

I'm glad you were able to find that disconnected vacuum balance tube. That would constitute a serious vacuum leak that would cause a very lean fuel/air mixture that could conceivably damage the engine, if it was allowed to continue. Don't forget that those rubber hoses that are used for vacuum connections can become hard and brittle over time, especially with exposure to heat. This can cause the hose to fit loosely over the metal tube. The hose may even become split. If the vacuum hoses are in poor condition on your engine they should probably be replaced. Hose clamps are not normally necessary if the rubber hoses are in good condition. But any vacuum leak at any connection point will impair engine operation and performance. The Clark's Corvair Parts catalog pages below lists some of the special vacuum hose sizes that are used on the balance tube and PCV system. If you opt to buy them locally be sure they are the correct size so that the elastic characteristics of the hose are correct to ensure a tight fit on the vacuum tube. Also, when checking for vacuum leaks remember that the vacuum break diaphragm assemblies on each carburetor can develop cracks in the plastic housing and/or leaks internally in the vacuum diaphragm. These also can be a source of vacuum leaks on your engine.



http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/catalog ... ow_page=61

...I'm about to go out and check if the gasket is still good and for other vacuum leaks from the modulator...

The vacuum modulator on the right side of the Powerglide automatic transmission has a limited lifespan.

If your modulator is more than 10 years old, you are really on borrowed time. The inner reinforced rubber diaphragm is really VERY THIN (0.017-0.019) and is weakened by hot PG fluid and constant flexing.

http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/catalog ... w_page=135


If you suspect that automatic transmission fluid may be drawn into the engine via the vacuum modulator, you can raise the car and place it on jack stands, and then crawl underneath to inspect the vacuum modulator. Try disconnecting the rubber hose that connects to the vacuum modulator and check it for oil content inside the hose. The hose should be dry and the vacuum modulator should not be allowing transmission fluid to pass from the transmission to the vacuum hose.