Harvey Aluminium flywheel

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ossieoz
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Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by ossieoz » Thu Dec 28, 2017 2:20 pm

Hi there, i’ve just recently been given a 9’’ Harvey Aluminium flywheel by a person that said it’s for a corvair. I’ve tried to google info but with no luck.

Can this be correct that it’ll work with a corvair? He said it will improve acceleration/performance...

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1961 Greenbrier, 1962 Rampside and 1964 Monza cab.

66vairguy
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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by 66vairguy » Thu Dec 28, 2017 5:20 pm

Years ago when the Corvair three piece flywheel rivets started coming loose, the aftermarket folks came up with a solid flywheel. It didn't take long before it was discovered the solid flywheels BROKE crankshafts. Yes - GM had a good reason to build that expensive three piece flywheel. GM engineer Benzinger discussed the reason at a convention and it was transcribed and available in print. Excellent reading.

That said the lighter aluminum bodied flywheels were CLAIMED to not cause a problem. NO FACTS to back that up.

Today Corvair flywheels are rebuilt - corventuredave has been doing them for years and has a good reputation.

About flywheel weight - The heavier the flywheel the better "launch" off line without bogging. The lighter the flywheel the faster the engine revs. No free lunch here. It comes done to what you want. NOTE: ALL Corvair flywheels weighed about the same. There were two different weights of LM pressure plates - lighter weight for all engines except the turbo and 140HP which got the heavier pressure plate to assist in smooth off the line launches for NORMAL driving.

That Harvey flywheel is certainly a collectors item and I wouldn't put it in a car, just clean it up and put it in your man cave.

martyscarr
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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by martyscarr » Thu Dec 28, 2017 6:58 pm

I have been using one of those flywheels for about 10 years in my 67 autocross car. It definitely improves acceleration, but you'll have to get used to a bit more RPMs and slower clutch engagement on takeoff. They are somewhat rare, I've probably only seen a dozen or so over the last 20 years.

One thing you should check is to see if the flywheel is flat, I have seen several of them warped from overheating.

HTH
Marty Scarr
Last edited by martyscarr on Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

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ossieoz
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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by ossieoz » Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:34 pm

Thanks for the info Marty and 66vairguy :)


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davemotohead
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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by davemotohead » Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:26 am

I have ran them for years with no ill effects and actually prefer them in my 140 as the acceleration is a lot better than the stock flywheel, I have never broken a crank shaft, but have worn a few of the flywheels out, I have 3 more NOS Harvey Aluminum's waiting for use, there were a lot of EM ones made as yours looks to be, BUT they did make LM ones also but they are much harder to find.
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ossieoz
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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by ossieoz » Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:12 am

davemotohead wrote:I have ran them for years with no ill effects and actually prefer them in my 140 as the acceleration is a lot better than the stock flywheel, I have never broken a crank shaft, but have worn a few of the flywheels out, I have 3 more NOS Harvey Aluminum's waiting for use, there were a lot of EM ones made as yours looks to be, BUT they did make LM ones also but they are much harder to find.
Thanks for the info Dave, i’ve noticed a crack on the ’copper’ surface, does the crack make the flywheel un-usable?

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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by davemotohead » Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:49 am

I would run it, but not in a greenbrier or rampy, they are mostly made for Racing applications.
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ossieoz
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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by ossieoz » Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:39 pm

davemotohead wrote:I would run it, but not in a greenbrier or rampy, they are mostly made for Racing applications.
So you think it could be useable in my 110 hp monza?


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martyscarr
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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by martyscarr » Sun Dec 31, 2017 3:40 pm

Just a follow up: Harvey Aluminum also made a lightweight aluminum contact ring for the Corvair pressure plate as well. They're apparently much rarer than the flywheels, I have only seen one in all my years of playing with Corvairs. I bought the one I saw and it's in my autocross car along with the lightweight flywheel, it gives me even less rotating weight than just the flywheel.
aluminum contact ring3.jpg
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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by joelsplace » Sun Dec 31, 2017 5:10 pm

How much does that aluminum flywheel weigh? You can take a bunch of weight off a stock flywheel. I have done that in a couple of my cars with no problems taking off and much better acceleration. One is an 85hp (yes EM automatic engine) and the other a 110hp. I read the above mentioned text just a few weeks ago and I thought he said the Corvair flywheel was designed that way to stop some kind of harmonic that made a bunch of noise. That couldn't be good for the crank.

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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by notched » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:37 am

For fastest acceleration from a stop you want the heavier flywheel. If you are road racing and worrying about faster acceleration out of a turn then go light flywheel. Corvair turbo cars benefit from the heavier weight...........even GM noticed this and that is the reason for the heavier pressure plate.
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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by 66vairguy » Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:23 pm

joelsplace wrote:
Sun Dec 31, 2017 5:10 pm
How much does that aluminum flywheel weigh? You can take a bunch of weight off a stock flywheel. I have done that in a couple of my cars with no problems taking off and much better acceleration. One is an 85hp (yes EM automatic engine) and the other a 110hp. I read the above mentioned text just a few weeks ago and I thought he said the Corvair flywheel was designed that way to stop some kind of harmonic that made a bunch of noise. That couldn't be good for the crank.
Here is a link to the Benzinger talk that was transcribed by Bob Helt. About eleven paragraphs down he gets into talking about the unique three piece flywheel and crankshaft harmonics. See http://www.vv.corvair.org/Library/benzinger.htm

The Benzinger discussion is a great read about some of the initial Corvair design decisions. Interesting for any Corvair enthusiast.

As a side note - I've read articles that suggest the first Porsche boxer six (designed AFTER the Corvair engine) prototype that used a similar bearing layout as the Corvair engine and was quietly abandoned for an increase in the number of crankshaft bearings.

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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by martyscarr » Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:03 pm

joelsplace wrote:
Sun Dec 31, 2017 5:10 pm
How much does that aluminum flywheel weigh? You can take a bunch of weight off a stock flywheel. I have done that in a couple of my cars with no problems taking off and much better acceleration. One is an 85hp (yes EM automatic engine) and the other a 110hp. I read the above mentioned text just a few weeks ago and I thought he said the Corvair flywheel was designed that way to stop some kind of harmonic that made a bunch of noise. That couldn't be good for the crank.
flywheels2.jpg
A stock 64-69 flywheel weighs about 13 pounds 4 ounces. Removing weight from a stock flywheel will help, but it's a long way to achieve the same weight of the aluminum ones.

As far as the crank harmonics with a solid flywheel, I'm not sure what effect the loss of approximately 9 pounds of rotating mass will have on the RPM where the peak torsional deflection takes place. I would *guess* it moves it upwards, but I don't know for sure. Here's a pic of the crankshaft torsional deflection graph.
harmonicbalancer008008.jpg
Last edited by martyscarr on Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by rfw66 » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:18 am

This brings up the Aluminum 10” WEBER clutches, of which I’ve only ever seen 2! One went into my 140 Corsa (sold to a guy in Tulsa, Ok in 78), the other one is on my shelf. It does however utilize the HD pp of the 140&180. Pictures later today.
Ken Hand has designed and produced a duel disk clutch. But I’m uncertain of the weight. IIRC, he claims it to be nearly indestructible. Last time I checked, they were N of $900.00!


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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by bbodie52 » Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:25 pm

:link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgg2FECFbUo
Corvair Dual Disc Clutch
GrasshutPerformance
Published on Oct 25, 2013

This is a product review on the new Dual Disc Clutch made for the Corvair by Ken Hand (corvairmechanic.com). This is a great investment for any stick shift Corvair in any kind of use.

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:link: http://corvaircenter.com/phorum/read.ph ... 262,599163
Posted by: vairmech ()
Date: December 06, 2012 02:24PM

I have the prototype clutch boxed and ready to go back along with a Corvair unit for dimensions on the crankshaft end and the starter ring size. I should have a working Corvair multi disc clutch with carbon/kevlar or fiber tuff facings in a couple of weeks.

This unit will take any regular flat faced throwout bearing and can be made with any number of available facing materials.

Ken Hand

Handy Car Care
248 613 8586

Vairmech@aol.com
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:link: http://corvairm.dev2.livedevelop.com/pr ... sc-clutch/

Dual Disc Clutch
$950.00


work of art
noun
a painting, sculpture, poem, piece of music, or other product of the creative arts, especially one with strong imaginative or aesthetic appeal.

At $950, you might want to hang it on display on your living room wall! It seems a shame to bury it out of sight in a Corvair clutch housing. :clap: :not worthy: :woo:
Image
ImageImageImageImageImage
:link: http://corvairm.dev2.livedevelop.com/

This is a destructive test of the Dual Disc clutch


Here is the story behind the video. I needed to know how much abuse this clutch could take. The video tells a lot but what isn’t there is I fixed the axle but I did nothing else. The owner drove the car home and then drove it all week long prior to the Dream Cruise all up and down Woodward Ave. doing burnouts where ever there was water put out and there was plenty! About a week after the Dream Cruise the owner heard some noise coming from the clutch and decided it was time to pull it. The rattling noise were the flywheel bolts, they had loosened with all the heat and stress. There were a couple of other issues but it was the bolts that made the clutch come out. A new clutch was put in the car and is still in it today.
Brad Bodie
Lake Chatuge, North Carolina
Image 1966 Corvair Corsa Convertible

rfw66
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Re: Harvey Aluminium flywheel

Unread post by rfw66 » Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:52 am

Well I’m a little late posting pictures of the 10” WEBER” clutch, but here it is. Although there is surface rust on it, this will be removed within the first minutes of use. But I will clean it up regardless.Image
On the back side of the FW WEBER is cast in the outer part of the FW. A rivet is going through the brand name.


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