Wheel movement

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my65
Posts: 155
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2015 12:20 pm
Location: porter texas

Wheel movement

Post by my65 »

I just purchased a 1963 monza 900 with a 64 transaxle in it. I needed to adjust the clutch pedal engagement and while removing the rear wheel, I felt a rocking motion. I set up an indicator to see how much and found .030 to .045, depending on which side!
Is this excessive bearing clearance or just deflection of the independent suspension? :dontknow:
Ed ( my65 )
65 Monza Convertible
110 HP 4 Speed
63 Monza Coupe
140 HP 4 Speed
66 Corsa Coupe
140hp 4 speed
Porter, Texas
my65
Posts: 155
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2015 12:20 pm
Location: porter texas

Re: Wheel movement

Post by my65 »

Just put tire and rim back on to check movement and it is the brake drum and rim! Lug nuts bottom out with . 1/8" clearance to drum and the web on the rim is more like 1/2" thick. Any suggestions on what and how to correct the movement?
Ed ( my65 )
65 Monza Convertible
110 HP 4 Speed
63 Monza Coupe
140 HP 4 Speed
66 Corsa Coupe
140hp 4 speed
Porter, Texas
my65
Posts: 155
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2015 12:20 pm
Location: porter texas

Re: Wheel movement

Post by my65 »

Correction........the brake drum is not moving just the wheel!
Ed ( my65 )
65 Monza Convertible
110 HP 4 Speed
63 Monza Coupe
140 HP 4 Speed
66 Corsa Coupe
140hp 4 speed
Porter, Texas
User avatar
bbodie52
Corvair of the Month
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Re: Wheel movement

Post by bbodie52 »

You didn't quite make it clear as to what type of wheels and lug nuts are currently fitted on your car. Does the loose wheel problem exist on both rear axle wheels, or on all four corners? If the wheels and lugs are custom, a better description with more detail might be helpful to those wishing to offer a potential solution. The article below includes detailed information regarding the installation of custom wheels from other cars, wheel lug problems, and suggested solutions. Check out the section under the heading Some Combinations.

Sizing Corvair Wheels and Tires
:link: http://autoxer.skiblack.com/tires.html

The supplier listed below is recommended on the above website. If you contact them and are able to describe exactly what the set up is on your car they may be able to provide a solution, such as replacement wheel lugs or replacement studs for the hub that are different length.

:link: http://www.prestigewheel.com/
Image

Email: orderdesk@prestigewheel.com

17150 Newhope St.
Suite 903
Fountain Valley, CA.92708
Sales: 800 854-6770
714 540-2100 local 714 540-5380 fax
Brad Bodie
Lake Chatuge, North Carolina
Image 1966 Corvair Corsa Convertible
my65
Posts: 155
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2015 12:20 pm
Location: porter texas

Re: Wheel movement

Post by my65 »

Thanks Brad, after reading your reply, I decided to start all over!

The wheels are Eagle Alloy 5 spoke 7x15
The lug nuts are Dorman bulge seat 7/16x 20 closed end
The problem does not exist on the front two wheels just the rear wheels
I reinspected the studs and lug nuts and found two bad studs ( bent about 3/8" from the end ) and two bad nuts ( would only thread on about 3/8" ) on the right side. The good nuts and studs were only engaging about 3 1/2 turns so I will change out all studs to 1 1/2" long. That will give me almost 1/2" engagement of the nut onto the stud.

After finishing the right rear, I installed that wheel and found the movement was still there and the wheel and brake drum moved as one!
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IMG_0317.JPG


I go back to my original question......is this movement bearing play and is it normal??
Ed ( my65 )
65 Monza Convertible
110 HP 4 Speed
63 Monza Coupe
140 HP 4 Speed
66 Corsa Coupe
140hp 4 speed
Porter, Texas
User avatar
jachord
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:16 pm

Re: Wheel movement

Post by jachord »

I would say that your wheel is not tightening down all the way. If you have a gap between the wheel and drum and the lug nuts are tight then something is interfering. If the hub is not moving then I doubt it is the bearings. The drum will move if the wheel is loose. The wheel holds the drum in place. Check the center of the wheel to make sure it will fit over the center of the hub. Pull the drum and lay it on the wheel and see how it all lines up. If you only have three threads showing you need longer studs.
1962 spyder tribute 700.
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bbodie52
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Re: Wheel movement

Post by bbodie52 »

You stated earlier that the front wheels appeared to be tight, and that the only problem was on the rear of the car — and that the problem existed on both sides of the rear. Are the wheels and lugs on the front of the car the same type as the rear?

You also stated that when you rock the rear tire and wheel (which at this point appears to be securely fastened to the hub and brake assembly by the wheel lugs) both the wheel and the brake drum moved together. If you examine the four photographs below you will see that the bearing assembly is secured to the brake backing plate and suspension by four nuts that hold it securely to four studs that project from the suspension arm. If you remove the wheel and brake drum you can gain access to these four nuts behind the axle hub. Have you checked them to make sure that they are all tight and secure?

Based on your description, I am trying to visualize how the wheel and brake drum could rock with perhaps excessive play as you apply pressure to either side of the wheel and tire. If the bearing flange is securely attached and held in place by the four studs that protrude from the suspension arm, then the brake backing plate and bearing flange are held firmly in place. The wheel and brake drum would have to be shifting while the brake backing plate and brake assembly would not be moving. I would think that this means the spherical bearing assembly would be allowing the wheel, hub, and axle to rock within the range allowed by the bearing assembly, while the brake backing plate and brake assembly are rigidly held in place on the suspension arm. The only other thing that secures the axle from rocking up and down would be the universal joint at the other end. Is it possible that excessive wear in the universal joint is allowing the center axle to shift up and down because of slop in the universal joint? If that is true you should be able to grasp the inner portion of the axle, near the differential, and physically rock it up and down while observing the universal joint — to see if you can observe if the cross portion of the universal joint is shifting within the needle bearing cups.

Your observations may tell you whether the play that you have detected in the wheel and axle hub is being caused by excessive wear in the axle bearing or in the universal joint at the other end of the axle. Please take a look and see if you can narrow down the cause of the play in the rear axles that you have detected. With the wheel securely mounted against the brake drum and hub, I would think that the excessive play would have to be caused by either the bearing at the outer end of the axle or by the needle bearings that are part of the universal joints next to the differential. Please let us know what you find.
Axle Mount (1).jpg
Axle Mount (2).jpg
Axle Mount (3).jpg
Axle Mount (4).jpg
Axle Mount (4).jpg (33.7 KiB) Viewed 468 times
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Brad Bodie
Lake Chatuge, North Carolina
Image 1966 Corvair Corsa Convertible
my65
Posts: 155
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2015 12:20 pm
Location: porter texas

Re: Wheel movement

Post by my65 »

Thank you for the information!!' I am in Paincourtville La. with my son's family for the next week and will check out the car on my return to Porter👍😊
Ed ( my65 )
65 Monza Convertible
110 HP 4 Speed
63 Monza Coupe
140 HP 4 Speed
66 Corsa Coupe
140hp 4 speed
Porter, Texas
my65
Posts: 155
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2015 12:20 pm
Location: porter texas

Re: Wheel movement

Post by my65 »

After getting back home, I checked the universals and they are ok. The axle bolts to the frame were snug but not torqued up, I tightened to 65foot pounds. I retested the wheel at OD of it's rim and got less movement ( about .025" ) I tried the stock wheel and got the same. I removed that wheel, tightened two lug nuts with just the brake drum, set indicator on axle, and got .010". Am I worrying about nothing....is this normal wear and I should just keep an eye and plan on replacing bearings in the future??
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Ed ( my65 )
65 Monza Convertible
110 HP 4 Speed
63 Monza Coupe
140 HP 4 Speed
66 Corsa Coupe
140hp 4 speed
Porter, Texas
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