Question on a ’64, 4 speed transmission rebuild

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AZScott
Posts: 86
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2016 11:57 am
Location: Tucson, Arizona

Question on a ’64, 4 speed transmission rebuild

Unread post by AZScott » Wed May 17, 2017 1:31 pm

I am in the middle of rebuilding a 1964 4 speed transmission. The process is moving along normally, the layshaft needle bearing and shaft were in bad shape and I am replacing them. Overall the layshaft and gears are in good shape and other than replacing the sliding 3rd gear which was marginal; I will reuse all of the original gears. I am also replacing the 4 brass blocker rings and 6 synchronizer keys, (all from Clarks). However I noticed that on the 4 brass blocker rings that were removed from the transmission, 3 appear to be 1-2 blocker rings with the longer hubs. Only one appears to be the shorter 3-4 blocker ring. I am not sure at this time on which side of the 3-4 synchronizer the longer hubed blocker ring came off of. The car when I got it was in very bad shape with no history, front suspension was bent up badly and the front brake cylinders were frozen. I was able to loosen up the front brake shoes and run the engine so I could carefully drive it on to a trailer. Prior to pulling the engine I was able to drive it slowly up the block to verify I had 4 gears and a working clutch, all appeared relatively normal, but it was not a very thorough testing.

Here are the 4 blocker rings that I removed, one on right has the shorter hub.
Image

Has anyone with transmission experience run into a situation with miss matched brass blocker rings? My plan is to put it all back to the way it should be, but thought I would ask the experts on the forum. Not sure if this was just a mistake made in a prior rebuild, or something done on purpose. The difference in blocker rings is very obvious.
63 Monza Coupe (164-4 carb)
64 Spyder Convertable
62 MGA Roadster
74 Norton Commando
69 Triumph Bonneville

brandegee
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:42 am
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Question on a ’64, 4 speed transmission rebuild

Unread post by brandegee » Fri May 19, 2017 6:49 am

I had to smile when I read your post. I bought a '63 spyder sight unseen (yes, I know that's dumb). It too is a basket case that wouldn't roll off the trailer because of a locked up RR drum. So far I've replaced the brake system, fuel system including tank, ignition system, engine wiring harness, rebuilt the engine and transmission...you get the idea. On the other hand I bought it for a project, and I'm loving it. I'm a little puzzled by your comments about the blocker rings. The 1-2 synchro should have 2 long blocker rings and the 3-4 synchro should have 2 short blocker rings. You can buy a another short blocker ring for the 3-4 synchro from Clark's for about $13, but I would just by an entire new 3-4 synchro from Clark's for only $30.

66vairguy
Posts: 1330
Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2010 3:44 pm

Re: Question on a ’64, 4 speed transmission rebuild

Unread post by 66vairguy » Fri May 19, 2017 9:17 am

I'm no expert on transmissions, that's why I use a local fellow who has worked on Corvair transmissions for decades. He was telling me the early transmissions changed almost every year and he finds mis-matched parts from previous repairs, improper clearances, etc.

You might try to find a local "expert" in your area through a club or post your location.

AZScott
Posts: 86
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2016 11:57 am
Location: Tucson, Arizona

Re: Question on a ’64, 4 speed transmission rebuild

Unread post by AZScott » Fri May 19, 2017 1:04 pm

Thanks guys. Like I said I plan to bring it back to standard parts and tolerances. I have all the new parts I need. I just found it hard to imagine someone that would go to the bother of rebuilding a transmission and use the wrong blocker ring. The difference between the 1-2 , and 3-4 blocker rings are obvious and well spelled out in all the manuals, it just didn’t seem like that would be done easily by mistake. Thought there could be another reason for it. Apparently not.
Brandagee, here is a picture of my 64 Spyder. A numbers correct, black, red interior, white electric top Spyder. The body is rough, but most of the parts are there. Image
It too has been a fun project, and by the time I am done will have everything either fixed or replaced. Tried to find a local transmission expert with no luck, so decided to do it myself, and to be honest, it wasn't that difficult. We are in the same area in that I am in Tucson.
63 Monza Coupe (164-4 carb)
64 Spyder Convertable
62 MGA Roadster
74 Norton Commando
69 Triumph Bonneville

brandegee
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:42 am
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Question on a ’64, 4 speed transmission rebuild

Unread post by brandegee » Fri May 19, 2017 2:09 pm

Sweet!

66vairguy
Posts: 1330
Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2010 3:44 pm

Re: Question on a ’64, 4 speed transmission rebuild

Unread post by 66vairguy » Fri May 19, 2017 4:57 pm

That's a nice project and will be fun when your done.

Oh you'd be surprised the things folks do wrong on old cars trying to fix them. As the saying goes "There's a reason it was parked and left to sit".

The early transmissions were Corvair specific so most transmission shops don't have experience with them. The 66 and later transmissions shared a lot with the revised Saginaw used in other GM cars.

Paul Kehler in San Diego, CA. does some Corvair transmission work, but I have no experience with his abilities.

Dan Drommerhausen in the South Coast Corsa club in Torrance, CA. has been doing Corvair transmission work for decades as a hobby and will do just a "get it going" repair to rebuilding to new specs (which can involve a lot of parts and $$$) depending on what you want him to do.

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