Newbie from Nebraska

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jcuda94
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Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2017 10:48 am

Newbie from Nebraska

Unread post by jcuda94 » Sun Apr 02, 2017 4:38 pm

Hi guys, thanks for the approval! I'm a 22 year old college student here in Omaha, Ne. I am a big car guy and own five vehicles, 3 of which are projects. I have a grandpa who is in decline so we are trying to consolidate some of his belongings per request. He is a farmer but also used to sell tractors so he has quite the array of toys as he would trade if a customer had a large amount of debt or just simply couldn't afford the machine. Several weeks ago we had an auction out on his farm to get rid of a few things but unfortunately I was unable to attend. Being a car guy I had my family who was in attendance keeping their eyes peeled for anything I could use for my current other car build. I gave the moms a call asking how it was going and what other kinds of items were up for auction. Her, knowing how big of a car nut I am, briefly mentioned that two vehicles were for sale and moved on to overload me with other items available in hopes that she didn't get my attention. WRONG!!! I ended up working out of her that there a barn find '64 Corvair Monza with roughly 63xxx some miles on it. I gave her a list of things to check out on it for me in concern with the quality of the paint, chrome, interior and motor. Nothing major grabbed her attention other than the little bits of mouse poop on the floor. I convinced her to bid for me but not to go any higher than $5000 as I wanted a car of my grandpas to remember him by. I was at work when the auction began so I couldn't listen in but received the good news that she had won the car several hours later. The opening bid was set at $5000 and not a single bid came in and the car was removed from auction. She ended up convincing the family to let me have the car for $3000 which I'm under the impression is a steal! I haven't gotten a chance to get a look at the car other than a few pictures she sent me prior to the auction. I've been trying to get my research in on what I need to do before trying to get her to run but all the advice seems to be so spread out. The car hasn't been started for ten years but the last time it did was in the county parade. I'm assuming I need to take a look at the carb., clear out the tank and fuel lines, and give the wiring a good once over. Is there anything else in particular that y'all think i need to focus on and what should I do in terms of the things I have mentioned. I am completely new to this style of car so any advice would be greatly appreciated as I don't want to screw anything up. I'll attach the few pictures that I have and I'll let y'all take a look. I will update the post as more info comes in. Thanks guys! :wave:
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Firefighter/EMT & Full-Time Student (Emergency Management)
'64 Corvair Monza (restoration)
'12 VW Jetta GLI Autobahn (daily)
'02 Land Rover Discovery 2 SE7 (daily)
'92 Nissan 240sx Hatch (project)
'05 Kawasaki ZZR 600 (daily)

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terribleted
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Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 2:36 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA
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Re: Newbie from Nebraska

Unread post by terribleted » Sun Apr 02, 2017 5:33 pm

Welcome. Looks like that could be a very nice car to fool with. From the photos it looks straight and solid.
Corvair guy since 1982. I have personally restored at least 20 Vairs, many of them restored ground up.
https://www.facebook.com/tedsautorestoration/

Located in Snellville, Georgia

Jerry Whitt
Posts: 585
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:42 pm

Re: Newbie from Nebraska

Unread post by Jerry Whitt » Sun Apr 02, 2017 6:27 pm

Welcome to the Forum!!

Looks like a fun project.
Jerry Whitt
ASE CERTIFIED MASTER TECHNICIAN
Retired
Hemet, Callifornia
65 Monza, purchased new
65 Corsa convertible

66vairguy
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Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2010 3:44 pm

Re: Newbie from Nebraska

Unread post by 66vairguy » Wed Apr 05, 2017 4:26 pm

The 64 is the best of the EM cars as far as suspension goes. Is it a 4 speed or automatic?

ALL the fluids will have to be changed. NEVER start an engine with old gasoline, or new gas in an old dirty gas tank - great way to seize up the engine valves as reported a few times. Expect the oil pan to have a layer of crud in it. Before starting the car pull the spark plugs and inspect them.
After changing the oil, pull the distributor and install a dummy shaft into the oil pump and prime the engine. Once started, and nothing bad happens, keep the engine RPM above 1500 RPM for a few minutes so the cam, piston wrist pins, and valve train get oiled. If the car was well maintained, then 63K miles isn't that high. Do expect to replace the pushrod seals with viton type if the originals are in place. Once sealed properly Corvairs don't leak oil, or very little.

If the body is solid and rust free you have a nice car there with a lot of potential.

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Steve62
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Location: Altadena, California (Just north of Pasadena)

Re: Newbie from Nebraska

Unread post by Steve62 » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:27 pm

Welcome, and enjoy the new project! Patience is your best friend when resurrecting one of these. If there is mouse poop, check the wiring carefully, as they love to eat the insulation. You also might want to remove the top engine shroud when you have the carbs off to check for nests in the cooling fins. It appears that you have a nice car there.
Could be better, could be worse...could be riding in a hearse!

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ral1963
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 9:44 pm
Location: Illinois

Re: Newbie from Nebraska

Unread post by ral1963 » Sat Apr 08, 2017 6:28 am

In the engine compartment, there is a small tag attacked to the rear frame rail, this is the Fisher Body tag and has a lot of the information about how the car left the factory. Post a picture of this tag and some of us will decode the details for you.

Build date, original body color and interior color, body number, assembly plant, and some specific options...

Your car appears to be a 1964 model with some other years parts added on, but the Trim tag will tell us for sure what it is...
Rick Loving
Corvair historian & chronicler of useless facts
CORSA
Performance Corvair Group
Chicagoland Corvair Enthusiasts

RAL1963@COMCAST.NET
Just south of Chicago IL
Current Rides
63 Sprint Vert 140/4sp

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ral1963
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 9:44 pm
Location: Illinois

Re: Newbie from Nebraska

Unread post by ral1963 » Sat Apr 08, 2017 6:31 am

From the pic's I can see it is a 64 (diff level check in engine bay) and it is a Powerglide (dash shift and fill check in engine bay)...
Rick Loving
Corvair historian & chronicler of useless facts
CORSA
Performance Corvair Group
Chicagoland Corvair Enthusiasts

RAL1963@COMCAST.NET
Just south of Chicago IL
Current Rides
63 Sprint Vert 140/4sp

jcuda94
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2017 10:48 am

Re: Newbie from Nebraska

Unread post by jcuda94 » Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:21 pm

Thanks for the tips 66vairguy, Steve62, and ral1963.
I have a new thread that I started for the entirety of the revival of the car and i'll be posting VIN information along with the Fisher Body Tag as I get the pics. Below is the link too the new thread.
https://www.corvairforum.com/forum/view ... 52&t=12890
Firefighter/EMT & Full-Time Student (Emergency Management)
'64 Corvair Monza (restoration)
'12 VW Jetta GLI Autobahn (daily)
'02 Land Rover Discovery 2 SE7 (daily)
'92 Nissan 240sx Hatch (project)
'05 Kawasaki ZZR 600 (daily)

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bbodie52
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Re: Newbie from Nebraska

Unread post by bbodie52 » Wed Apr 19, 2017 3:46 am

:clap: :welcome2: :wave: :tu: Welcome to the Corvair Forum!

Your initial post has me all excited about this car — and I'm not even the owner!! Congratulations to your Mom for finding what appears to be a complete and solid "barn find" Corvair, and for taking advantage of the lack of bids to talk the price down for you. The 1964 Corvair is the best of the Early Model (EM — 1960-1964) Corvairs. It is the recipient of five model years of refinements, including a displacement increase from 145 CI to 164 CI, an improved cooling fan made of magnesium, which greatly improved fan belt reliability by reducing the rotational mass and the "flywheel effect" stresses on the belt. The 1964 Corvair was the first model year to receive a front anti-sway bar as standard on all models, and the only model year to receive a rear suspension transverse leaf spring to improve handling and stability.

If you need a shop manual and supplements, they can be downloaded in Adobe Reader (.pdf) format at no cost, using the link below...

Common and Useful Corvair Websites
:link: viewtopic.php?f=225&t=6007

I have been around Corvairs since my parents bought their first new Corvair in 1961 — a 4-speed Monza coupe. (I was 8 years old at the time). They later bought a new 1965 Corvair Corsa convertible, and I learned to drive in that car and took my first driver's test in it. We have driven Corvairs for decades all over the USA and in Germany while serving with the U.S. Air Force, and at age 64 my wife and I still own a 1966 Corsa convertible.

Since you are unfamiliar with Corvairs, I will try to throw a lot of Corvair-specific information at you that you may find helpful...

Your aging and somewhat stale Corvair needs a thorough mechanical check. The condition of the seals in the master cylinder and wheel cylinders is certainly questionable. All should be inspected. You may want to consider replacing the single master cylinder with a dual master cylinder upgrade (available from Clark's Corvair Parts and others). The flexible brake hoses are likely in poor condition and should be replaced, and all four wheel cylinders should be rebuilt or replaced. Of course the drums and brake components should be inspected and repaired, as needed, and the brake fluid should be flushed and replaced. (Brake fluid is hygroscopic and absorbs moisture from the air over time. Excess water build-up in the fluid can rust steel brake lines and cause corrosive damage to the internal wheel and master cylinders. Moisture in the brake fluid will also lower the boiling point, which can result in early brake fade as the brakes get hot).

:link: http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/catalog ... w_page=143

There is a long parking brake cable that is routed through several pulleys to the rear of the car, and another cable at the rear that crosses over between the two rear brakes. The condition of these cables and pulleys must be inspected and repairs made, as needed. The plastic pulleys may crack or break with age. The condition of the parking brake system is particularly important in automatic transmission equipped Corvairs, because Corvair Powerglide automatic transmissions do not have a PARK position in the shift lever to lock the transmission. The emergency brake system is the only way to secure the car and prevent it from rolling away when parked! The aging parking brake cable can fray and snap without warning.

:link: http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/catalog ... N&page=148

The Corvair Powerglide transmission has a good reputation for reliability, but fluid levels must be properly maintained. Overfilling can cause the rotating planetary gearset and clutches to spin in a bath of fluid, causing air entrainment (foaming). Low fluid levels can cause low oil pressure, clutch slipping and burning, etc. The automatic transmission is basically a fluid-based computer. Your transmission fluid should be clean and red in color, and should not show a brown discoloration or have a burned smell. Also, the vacuum modulator on the right side of the transmission depends on a good vacuum line from the engine. The rubber hoses should be checked for cracks or wear. If oil appears to be present in the vacuum line, the vacuum modulator diaphragm may be worn out — permitting transmission fluid to be drawn from the transmission to the engine. Clark's Corvair Parts says "if your vacuum modulator is over 10 years old, you are running on borrowed time." A bad vacuum modulator should be replaced — it cannot be repaired.

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:link: http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/catalog ... IN&page=57

:link: http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/catalog ... w_page=135

Removing your car from storage/Reviving a Dead Corvair
:link: viewtopic.php?f=225&t=5030

Check your battery ground to ensure that the ground cable is attached to BOTH the car chassis AND the engine, as shown in the diagrams below. The engine and transaxle are physically and electrically isolated from the car chassis because of the three rubber engine mounts. If a single battery ground cable is only connected to the chassis, the starter, generator and engine may not be adequately grounded. This could cause starter or generator problems.

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The information below pertains to the Interstate battery line that fits the limited, odd sized battery box area in Early Model Corvairs. Feedback I've heard from buyers of the Interstate battery line seems to indicate that this brand is a quality product.
If you need a new battery, the odd size and shape of the EM battery box might confuse things a bit. Clark's charges quite a bit for a battery that is similar in appearance to the originals...

Part number C12541: 61-64 CAR & 61-65 FC SCRIPT BATTERY *1960 SEE C13056

Weight: 30 lbs 0 oz
Catalog Pages(s): 79
Price: $ 264.55


But there are some other choices that will fit, will provide better service, are locally available, and cost less. The battery information below has proven to provide a good fit in the standard early model Corvair (1961-1964) battery box.

:idea: Here is a battery tip for early model Corvairs like yours that may help you to get an affordable battery for your early Corvair. Be sure to compare the battery dimensions with the available battery space in your Corvair. The dealer catalogs and references are unlikely to tell them if this battery will fit your car...
freedo wrote:In my EM i ran a Interstate 51 battery, might have been a 51R can't remember off the top of my head. its a honda civic batter, its small so it fits in there, but it doesnt fill in the whole space. worked perfectly fine for me. cranked everytime, never let me down
:link: http://www.interstatebatteries.com/cs_e ... +++500+CCA

MEGA-TRON 51-R AUTOMOTIVE BATTERY 75 MONTHS 500 CCA

Get long life and premium performance with Interstate Batteries' Mega-Tron 51R. With 24-months free replacement and five-year performance, this 500 CCA automotive battery will meet or exceed your vehicle's starting requirements in any hot to moderate climate.

Sugg Retail Price: $107.95
List Price: $129.95
Dealer prices will vary

Product ID: MT-51R
Amps: 625
Cranking Amps: 625
Cold Cranking Amps: 500
Voltage: 12
Termination: A
Weight: 27.9
Width: 5.13
Length: 9.38
Height: 8.88
Plates: 24
WET/DRY: W


:wrench: Here is some additional info on the use of the Interstate 51 battery...
freedo wrote:you have to make sure your tie down is tight or it will slide side to side. or you can make some plastic pieces to wedge it into shape. but interstate are strong good batteries. when i blew the motor up i had the lights on and the interior light on for almost a hour and when i went to start it up the next day it cranked right over
It appears that the only difference between the Interstate MT-51R and the MT-51 is the location of the positive and negative battery terminals...

MEGA-TRON 51-R AUTOMOTIVE BATTERY 75 MONTHS 500 CCA
:link: http://www.interstatebatteries.com/cs_e ... +++500+CCA
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MEGA-TRON 51 AUTOMOTIVE BATTERY FIVE-YEAR PERFORMANCE 500 CCA
:link: http://www.interstatebatteries.com/cs_e ... L4%2f1.3L)
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As shown in the picture below, the correct battery appears to be the Interstate MT-51R, which places the positive terminal correctly on the right when the battery is placed in the battery area with the terminals facing the engine.

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Whenever the battery is disconnected from the vehicle for any reason the polarization procedure should be performed.

The recommendation on how to polarize a charging system is the following: After the installation of a battery, generator or voltage regulator follow these procedures. The terminals on the voltage regulator are labeled with letters and this is where you will do the polarizing procedure. Both of the components will have battery power so do not start the vehicle or turn on the ignition switch before polarizing them. You will need a small piece of wire fourteen or sixteen gauge with alligator clips on the ends. Find the "Batt" terminal on the regulator and attach one of the alligator clips, find the "Armature" terminal and touch the terminal with the other alligator clip. You can touch the terminals a few times and it will produce a soft light spark.

:nono: Under no circumstances touch the "Field" terminal or any other part of the regulator or you could damage the regulator.

:link: http://www.vv.corvair.org/pipermail/vir ... 13475.html

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What you want to do is polarize the generator. If in fact it ran with reverse polarity, everything should be fine after this process. You should not have damaged anything yet.

With key off, use a piece of 14 gage or larger wire to jump between the battery and armature terminals of the voltage regulator. I am at work without a shop manual, so I forget the actual writing on the terminals. BUT, it is the top and middle terminal on Corvairs (with the regulator mounted stock position, red wires on top terminal).

It will spark! Hold for 1 or 2 seconds. The wire may also get warm, be prepared.

Start engine again and check for red light going out.
IT IS IMPORTANT TO POLARIZE A NEW GENERATOR BY FOLLOWING THE PROCEDURES IN THE CORVAIR SHOP MANUAL. THIS PROCEDURE IS DESCRIBED ON PAGE 8-18 OF THE ATTACHED SHOP MANUAL SECTION. This polarizing procedure applies ONLY to vehicles equipped with a GENERATOR. It does not apply to vehicles equipped with an alternator.

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When working on the Corvair engine, you will need to develop good habits with regard to working with aluminum components. Much of the Corvair engine was manufactured using aluminum, which is a relatively soft and easily damaged material. Bolts that screw into aluminum threads should be carefully threaded by hand to avoid the possibility of cross-threading. The use of anti-seize compound to coat the threads is recommended. A torque wrench should be utilized to properly tighten all fasteners using specifications listed in the Corvair shop manual. This will help you to avoid damaging any threads in the Corvair engine.

All suspension components should be examined. Ball joints and other front suspension components with grease fittings should be lubricated. Front wheel bearings should be cleaned, inspected, repacked and adjusted. With regard to the rear axle bearings (which are difficult to maintain and service, and are often neglected), here's a quote from the Clark's Corvair Parts catalog…
Clark's Corvair Parts Online Catalog, Page 165 wrote:REAR AXLE (WHEEL) BEARINGS — 1960-1964 CARS

The rear axle bearings are probably the most dangerous part of the whole car. It is not uncommon for the axle shaft to pull right out. In some cases the axle shaft just worked out and others the bearing has failed. The 1965-69 style fixed this but people with the earlier style should not ignore any possible bearing noises!
Rear axle universal joints also tend to be neglected — especially if they are not equipped with grease fittings. These also should be inspected and serviced or replaced, if needed.

As for tires, yours are likely dry-rotted and somewhat unsafe. 13" tires are still available from at least one manufacturer, but the size is obsolete and this category of tire is fast becoming a specialized product that caters to car collectors. (Most 13" tires offered by firms such as the Tire Rack are not for passenger cars. They are for use on TRAILERS ONLY). As such supply is limited, pricing is not optimum since it is not a competitive product, and performance and feature options ar limited. Upsizing to 14" or greater wheel diameter (4-lug) is also a consideration. The subject is discussed very well in the following article...

Sizing Corvair Wheels and Tires
:link: http://autoxer.skiblack.com/tires.html

:dontknow: I would like to encourage you to expand on your initial post and tell us more about yourself, your Corvair as you work through discovery with it, and describe your goals for the Corvair. If you can describe your personal assessment of your mechanical skills and abilities, that would help a lot. Members of the Corvair Forum love to be helpful in assisting other Corvair owners with technical support and advice, but it helps a lot if we have some understanding of your technical background and mechanical abilities, Corvair-related knowledge, etc. Helping us to know more about you will help us to write comments to you that are tailored to your needs and experience. Knowing your location is also useful, because knowing where you live can sometimes suggest possibilities.

:welcome:
Brad Bodie
Lake Chatuge, North Carolina
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