Any socket grounding tricks ?

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morevair
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Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by morevair »

All,

As I'm sure you all know Corvairs have grounding issues... (lights)... The typical plastic light socket need to ground via the metal socket ground on the end of the sockets (usually via compression to the body)... What I'm running into is since these "sockets" are 50+ years old, there's a lot of possible play... assuming all contacts are clean, the issues I run into are... socket ground compression not enough (requiring clip prying), socket ground compression too far recessed (requiring partial seating)... etc... I'm wonder if there are any tried methods out there (short of soldering a jump) to ensure these ground connections ? I was thinking of wrapping one of the prongs with foil to benefit grounding... Any ideas are welcome... and forgive my artwork...
ground.png
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Jeff M. in Phoenix, AZ
1966 Corsa 140 4-speed
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by terribleted »

Best solution new repro wires harness with new sockets in them. the engine bay and front trunk harnesses Clark's has have excellent bulb sockets for your late model they will ground well. Short of this you clean the edges of the holes and tinker the bends in the little grounding fingers. You try to find a way to keep the metal ground thing from popping out of the old socket, You buy a replacement plastic socket at the parts store and it lasts for a little bit and then falls apart (they are usually very cheap). You buy replacement metal snap in sockets at the auto parts....hard to find any more. You buy individual sockets from Clark's In stead of a harness and unless things have changed somehow you get the same crap sockets you find at the parts store (not the same parts as included in the harnesses. Other benefits of new harnesses particularly in the engine bay is no corrosion and they look pretty as well. I have seen people solder wires to the grounding portion of the sockets and screw the other end to the body.
Corvair guy since 1982. I have personally restored at least 20 Vairs, many of them restored ground up.
Currently working full time repairing Corvairs and restoring old cars.
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morevair
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by morevair »

So you're just confirming what I've already found out (thanks by the way)... this issues even happens with "new" sockets... and it's really a pain with the Corsa dash... you can't check it till it back in... it's just a bad design (sorry GM)... I'm going to experiment with some "jerry rigging" ... using some cheap foil... wish me luck...
ground.png
Jeff M. in Phoenix, AZ
1966 Corsa 140 4-speed
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by 66vairguy »

If you don't want to buy a new engine harness (and most are in bad shape, but maybe yours is not) you can get new bulb sockets from Clark's. Now I know someone will say you can get them cheaper at an auto parts store, but the Clark's sockets are a better socket. I've compared them and threw the parts stores sockets in the trash.

About the ground - You'll notice a small hole on the socket to install a 18 gauge wire and solder it one of the metal tabs that hold the socket in the enclosure. You don't want the wire to interfere with bulb or tab area that goes into the housing, usually solder at the tab bend and you'll need a good soldering iron. I have a good soldering iron with a big 800F tip and have fixed a number of club members "intermittent" rear lamps. Attach ground wire to the body, the engine sheet metal ground straps to the body is a good place.
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by 64powerglide »

We'll forgive the artwork but you forgot to say dash lights in you first post. ::-):
64Powerglide, Jeff Phillips

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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by terribleted »

I was assuming tail lamp type sockets, but, the dash sockets in Corsa dashes are similar in design. Generally these do not give lots of trouble. I have always had plenty of spares from other dashes to splice in for the few that will not behave. I have not tried to source new ones individually. If you are having issues with many or most of these I would suspect a bad dash ground. The ground strap on the bottom left of the cluster (just outboard from the steering column) must have good contact for the lights to function properly. This strap is simply a tab off of the large metal surround on the back of the cluster that everything bolts down through. If it is not solidly and electrically attached to the steel dash framework, intermittent operation of everything in the cluster is possible.
Corvair guy since 1982. I have personally restored at least 20 Vairs, many of them restored ground up.
Currently working full time repairing Corvairs and restoring old cars.
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acarlson
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by acarlson »

I had a similar issue with my brake light socket. I tried one of the auto store replacements but it didn't work too well - I gave up on it. I bought this socket off of Amazon:
socket.jpeg
socket.jpeg (49.87 KiB) Viewed 2073 times
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001RPZ0ZM/

I had some issues with it - here goes:
  • The spring pins on the perimeter are a tight fit in the Corvair socket hole. I had to press a few of them in in order to add some relief.
  • Unlike the stock socket, there is no tab to set the orientation of the socket in the hole. You have to predetermine the bulb orientation so the filaments face toward the rear of the car before you install the socket.
  • Unlike the stock socket, this socket has 2 spring loaded electrical contacts. These are a pain since they are not secured to the socket body and will slip out of the socket holes. Not a big issue but they're a pain to get back into place.
  • The socket wires are both balck and not color coded so you have to figure out which wire is the tail light and which one is the stop light.
This socket will work, and work well - but it takes a little time and patience to get it installed correctly.

Alec
Alec Carlson
Dahlonega, GA
1965 Regal Red Corsa 4 Speed Turbo Convertible
Restoration "In Progress"...
morevair
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by morevair »

Thanks for the tip on the 18 gauge hole, I'll definitely take advantage of that... as far as not mentioning "dash", I was referring to all the socket types... My engine harness is new, and still has grounding issues (just a bad design in my opinion) so the 18 gauge jumper will help... and I know I have a good dash ground, when I had it out, I soldered a ground wire to the ground strap for additional grounding. I's just that the individual dash sockets are so finicky... work for awhile, stop working, wiggle the socket, starts again... So i'll attempt some sort of jumper for them too... Wish me luck... and thanks for all the responses...
Jeff M. in Phoenix, AZ
1966 Corsa 140 4-speed
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by 66vairguy »

morevair wrote: Sat Feb 17, 2018 11:14 am Thanks for the tip on the 18 gauge hole, I'll definitely take advantage of that... as far as not mentioning "dash", I was referring to all the socket types... My engine harness is new, and still has grounding issues (just a bad design in my opinion) so the 18 gauge jumper will help... and I know I have a good dash ground, when I had it out, I soldered a ground wire to the ground strap for additional grounding. I's just that the individual dash sockets are so finicky... work for awhile, stop working, wiggle the socket, starts again... So i'll attempt some sort of jumper for them too... Wish me luck... and thanks for all the responses...
My experience with the LM Corsa dash socket has been good. You may have a corroded housing or possibly someone was heavy handed installing the sockets (once you bend the tabs they tend not to hold). A NEW harness can be installed. Clark's sells them. On the LM cars the instrument cluster harness is short and plugs into the main dash/fuse box harness. Replacing it isn't a major deal unlike the EM Spyder cars.

BTW - If you coat the socket edges with a Di-electric grease they will go in easy and won't corrode. Same with the main connector which is difficult to unplug or plug back together. Coat the contacts and shell edges and it will plug together easier and the contacts won't corrode.
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bbodie52
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by bbodie52 »

Image

:think: :idea: Aluminum Bulb Socket
From Ron Francis

Aluminum Bulb Socket
Special billet aluminum socket with oversize flange helps cover original socket holes. Socket has a large aluminum nut to make installation easy.


These special aluminum sockets were developed and produced by Ron Francis Wiring. Although I have not yet personally tried these (yet), I believe that I would try this approach to install secure aluminum sockets in place of the relatively cheap factory sockets. If needed, a short ground wire pigtail could be attached to each lamp housing to provide a positive wired ground connection to the vehicle chassis.

Image
RR-33 Special Billet Aluminum Socket

RR-33 Special Billet Aluminum Socket Double Filament / Staggered Pins

These sockets have an oversized flange to cover the existing original socket hole. Large aluminum nut to make installation easier. Uses 3/4” mounting hole. (Sold individually)

Typically uses 1157 & our 1077 bulbs.

Item Number: RR-33

Unit Price: $25.95
:link: https://www.ronfrancis.com/prodinfo.asp?number=RR-33

Image
Ron Francis Wiring Tech Tip - Socket Repair
Ron Francis Wiring Tech Tip - Socket Repair
=================================================================================================

Here is another interesting solution that Ron Francis Wiring offers on page 33 and 36 of their catalog (attached).

HAVE AN IDIOT LIGHT WITH YOUR ONE-WIRE ALTERNATOR!

LOW VOLTAGE SENSOR FOR ALTERNATORS

This product is a voltage sensor that is used with “One-Wire” and other alternators to light an indicator (idiot) light when the vehicle voltage drops below 11 volts. Simplifies the wiring to use an idiot light on ALL alternators and replaces the circuit that is missing on a “One-Wire” alternator and is a better reference than on a factory indicator.
LS-11. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . $ 28.95

FOR YOUR ENTERTAINMENT AND PERHAPS INSPIRATION, I SUGGEST YOU TAKE A FEW MINUTES TO BROWSE THROUGH THE ATTACHED RON FRANCIS CATALOG. It is filled with possibilities for your Corvair wiring!
Attachments
2017 Ron Francis Wiring Catalog.pdf
2017 Ron Francis Wiring Catalog
(16.32 MiB) Downloaded 44 times
Brad Bodie
Lake Chatuge, North Carolina
Image 1966 Corvair Corsa Convertible
morevair
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by morevair »

Thanks Brad, I definitely will utilize the dielectric grease. I guess I should’ve also mentioned the dash harness is also new.
Jeff M. in Phoenix, AZ
1966 Corsa 140 4-speed
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by terribleted »

I'm sure you have tried lightly sanding the edges of the bulb socket holes? I have not had issues like this with the new instrument harnesses I have gotten from Clark's. Is it from Clark's?
Corvair guy since 1982. I have personally restored at least 20 Vairs, many of them restored ground up.
Currently working full time repairing Corvairs and restoring old cars.
https://www.facebook.com/tedsautorestoration/

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Allan Lacki
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by Allan Lacki »

Late-series Corvair tail light socket cure-all. Click on this link and see the article named "Silly Sockets"!

http://www.corvair.org/chapters/lvcc/lv ... _wheel.pdf
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Allan Lacki
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by Allan Lacki »

Instrument panel lamp grounding: I had a troublesome light bulb in my Corsa instrument panel. It wouldn't ground properly. I cured it by replacing the original socket with a Cole Hersee 2506 miniature lamp socket. I bought it online.
Cole Hersee 2506 miniature base socket
Cole Hersee 2506 miniature base socket
cole_hersee_2506_lamp_socket.jpg (52.23 KiB) Viewed 1986 times
The socket is made of steel and has a pigtail for grounding. It snapped into the original socket hole with no problem whatsoever. All I had to do was remove the old one and splice the Cole Hersee unit into the instrument panel's wiring harness. ::-):
66vairguy
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by 66vairguy »

The metal sockets are an improvement, but you still have a ground going through the housing that corrodes attached to the body panel by wire nuts that corrode - getting the idea. A wire soldered to the socket (and some sockets come with a ground wire attached) that is secured to the body gives the lowest path of resistance and the brightest light output.
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Allan Lacki
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Re: Any socket grounding tricks ?

Post by Allan Lacki »

There are actually two problems with plastic sockets: (1) grounding of the socket against the body of the car, and (2) steel insert backing out of the body of the plastic socket, opening a gap between the positive tip or tips of the bulb and the electrical contact(s) at the bottom of the plastic socket.
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