Brakes/lights

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Jeromie78
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Brakes/lights

Post by Jeromie78 »

Ok so it seems the brakes aren't releasing like they need to when I take my foot off of the pedal.
Also the lights on the right side are more dim than the left side.
Any thoughts on either of these issues...


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larry202br
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by larry202br »

The light issue is most likely a grounding problem. Many have modified the light sockets, adding a ground wire. When were you're brakes last serviced? You may have to jack each wheel off the ground, and turn by hand to see which one is sticking.
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by terribleted »

The dim light is most likely a grounding issue or a bad bulb. If the brakes are actually not releasing find and repair the brake system problem and then if the brake lights stay on adjust the pedal or switch so they don't.
Corvair guy since 1982. I have personally restored at least 20 Vairs, many of them restored ground up.
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by bbodie52 »

Jeromie78 wrote:Ok so it seems the brakes aren't releasing like they need to when I take my foot off of the pedal.
Also the lights on the right side are more dim than the left side.
:dontknow: Does the car seem to pull in one direction (left or right), or just drag evenly in a straight line? If it seems to pull left or right, it may just be one wheel with a sticking wheel cylinder, broken return spring, etc. If it drags in a straight line it could be a sticking master cylinder, a problem with the parking brake cables, pulleys, etc.

:dontknow: Are the dim lights on the right headlights, tail or brake lights, or ??? If you can be more specific, it might point to the cause.
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Jeromie78
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by Jeromie78 »

It pulls straight while braking.
As far as the lights go, it's headlights and tail lights on the right side.


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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by bbodie52 »

I'm assuming you are saying that the brakes appear to be dragging evenly on both sides when you release pressure on the brake pedal, and it does not pull to one side or the other. You might check to see of the parking brake cable is fully releasing. A broken cable pulley or a frayed parking brake cable could be preventing a full release of the rear brakes.

If the parking brake lever and cables appear to be fully relaxed in the rear (where the cable crosses to both wheels), then the cause of the brakes dragging could be hydraulic. If you raise the car on jack stands you may be able to detect dragging as you turn each wheel manually while it is off of the ground Check the brake pedal for free movement, as shown in the picture below (described on page 5-3 of the attached shop manual supplement 1962-1963 Supplement - Chevrolet Corvair Shop Manual - Section 5 - Brakes. If you determine that the parking brake mechanism is not causing the drag, and you find adequate free brake pedal travel, and if the brake drag appears to be on all four wheels, a sticking master cylinder might be the cause. Since it is a single master cylinder, the front and rear brakes are all linked hydraulically. releasing fluid at any wheel would release pressure from all four wheels. If opening a bleeder valve on one wheel releases dragging on all four, the source of the pressure is likely a sticking master cylinder. If only one wheel is dragging, the problem is likely contained at that one wheel cylinder or springs, etc.
Brake Pedal Free Movement.jpg
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Attachments
1962-1963 Supplement - Chevrolet Corvair Shop Manual - Section 5 - Brakes.pdf
1962-1963 Supplement - Chevrolet Corvair Shop Manual - Section 5 - Brakes
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by 66vairguy »

The MC has a return port to allow fluid return from the wheel cylinders. If the MC plunger does not travel all the way back, either due to internal corrosion or mis adjusted brake pedal rod, then the brakes may not fully release - ALL THE BRAKES.

If it is just one wheel then check the brake hose. Old brake hoses swell inside and prevent fluid return, or slow it considerably. It's not as unusual as you might think. Brake hoses are perishable.

Of course there are a number of other possibilities already mentioned.
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by bbodie52 »

:goodpost:

I had forgotten about the brake hose swelling issue, which is also mentioned at the bottom of the Clark's Corvair Parts catalog page below...

:link: http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/catalog ... w_page=144
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If you discover that corrosion has eaten away or damaged the master cylinder or wheel cylinders, you might want to consider the possibility of internal damage to the steel brake lines as well. Brake fluid is hygroscopic and over time absorbs and holds water molecules, which can result in corrosion and pitting in your brake cylinders. Water accumulation in aging brake fluid can also lower the fluid boiling point, which can cause brake fading as the brake temperature increases with heavy use. Internal damage and decay may also occur in your brake lines, which can burst without warning. If you do find a fault or corrosion in your master cylinder, you may want to convert to the dual master cylinder that was incorporated into the Corvair in 1967, instead of simply replacing the single master cylinder with the same type.

:link: http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/catalog ... w_page=145
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Clark's recommends flushing the brake fluid and replacing it every 2-3 years.
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toytron
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by toytron »

Has anyone here used silicone brake fluid? I have read this article from http://www.mossmotors.com and they go on to say that changing over to silicone should only be done as a complete overhaul and not a flush of old glycol based to silicone though Clark's mentions that you can just flush out the old with silicone.

http://www.mossmotors.com/SiteGraphics/ ... page5.html


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lostboy
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by lostboy »

toytron wrote:Has anyone here used silicone brake fluid? I have read this article from http://www.mossmotors.com and they go on to say that changing over to silicone should only be done as a complete overhaul and not a flush of old glycol based to silicone though Clark's mentions that you can just flush out the old with silicone.

http://www.mossmotors.com/SiteGraphics/ ... page5.html


Ed Stevenson
There are mixed reviews of silicone fluid. I have also heard it is not good to mix them. I will yield to someone who knows more about the science of it all.


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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by toytron »

Yes, I had to research it a little further before I jumped in.

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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by azdave »

Certainly don't mix them. Also, don't confuse synthetic brake fluid with silicone brake fluid as some people do.

No silicone brake fluid manufacturer wants to see their product fail because someone doesn't do a proper cleansing first. A poor flush job can lead to a failure that gets blamed in the silicone fluid so I doubt they are going to be okay with a simple flush to make the change.

Clark's might say "flush and drive" but probably not the maker of the fluid (nor would I). Unless you are prepared to open up the MC, wheel cylinders and flush the lines then don't change to silicone brake fluid.

I run regular brake fluid in my cars expect for those that have received a complete brake rebuild. At that point, I have changed to silicone with no issues.
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by Rick's 65 turbo »

I'm having the same issue, the car stops straight but will not release. I adjusted the push rod to get more clearance and it did not help. Is the most likely cause that the fluid is not returning to the M/C? How can I determine that?

Thanks, Rick.
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by bbodie52 »

If the car is not pulling to the right or left when you apply the brakes, this indicates that the brake shoes are likely being evenly applied to the drums equally on all four wheels. It reduces the chance of a corroded/sticking wheel cylinder.

There could be a problem with corrosion build-up in the master cylinder that prevents the piston from returning fully to the neutral position when there is no pressure on the brake pedal. Since DOT3 brake fluid is hygroscopic it absorbs moisture from the air over time. Flush and replace the fluid every few years to prevent rust and corrosion in the master and wheel cylinders and steel brake lines. If you suspect a master cylinder problem, and if you still have a single master cylinder in your Corvair, you may want to consider an upgrade while simultaneously servicing, inspecting, and flushing the system to install fresh brake fluid. A dual master cylinder was introduced in 1967, and can be retrofitted to 1962-1966 Corvairs. Rubber brake lines can swell up internally and decay with age. Also be sure to check the parking brake cables and pulleys. These are particularly important on a Powerglide automatic transmission-based Corvair, since the Corvair automatic lacks a PARK position to lock the transmission. Because of that the Corvair relies heavily on the parking brake system, which is the only thing that prevents your Corvair from rolling away on a hill! If a plastic pulley cracks or a cable snaps (usually without warning) your car can decide to take an unaccompanied trip without your permission.

:link: https://ssl.corvair.com/user-cgi/catalo ... w_page=145

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Attachments
1965 Corvair Chassis Shop Manual - SECTION 5 - BRAKES.pdf
1965 Corvair Chassis Shop Manual - SECTION 5 - BRAKES
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by Rick's 65 turbo »

Thanks Brad, this seems most likely. I'll pull some wheels off to see if there's anything else going on (if I can get them off).
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Re: Brakes/lights

Post by Rick's 65 turbo »

the drums I mean...
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